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weak bench cost us 3 points

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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby MTFCMusings » Wed Feb 17, 2021 9:05 pm

‪I think Clough’s been unlucky with three injuries at the same time. He said pre-January that you can’t plan for injuries, which I don’t necessarily agree with.

It’s a difficult balancing act between having a core group and have expensive players sat on the bench I suppose.‬
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby tmwilson » Wed Feb 17, 2021 9:13 pm

I think we lost a bit of shape when Quinn went off.
Tonight the bench was weak but there should be no reason whatsoever that the starting 11 couldn't finish that game.. None of them played badly. Tiredness should not come into it.
Unfortunately, having Lapslie and Gordon out weakened us. We would of has sufficient cover on the bench if those two were fit but we knew any injuries would affect us.
In whole I thought we played well. Both teams could of scored more.
I do think Cloughie has resigned himself for this season being in league two and anything else is a bonus. I'm not going to complain about one defeat after our excellent run.
It's just frustrating we couldn't hold on in the last two games.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Wed Feb 17, 2021 9:25 pm

We could have Jimmy Knowles back in a couple of weeks if the conference folds which is a good possibility. Fresh legs up front may have encouraged them to hold back a little more instead of flooding forward in numbers.

It’s gone now so no point in dwelling on the game, onwards and upwards.
Who are you calling pedantic? I resemble that remark!
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Wed Feb 17, 2021 9:46 pm

I don't think the bench cost us. I would not have brought Mal Benning on. It is hard for subs to come on and get up to speed in a game. Stephen Quinn was having his best game for the Stags. I would have left him on.

If we needed anybody to come on then we needed a right sided player to mark Declan John and go with him when he made his runs.

Where was Harry Charsley when Declan John was going forward?

What was Mal Benning doing defending at the near post? He does have an unfortunate knack of scoring own goals.

I'm just watching the last 10-15 minutes back again to try and work out what went wrong.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Amber Andy » Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:00 pm

pemill wrote:
broomo wrote:Gut wrenching.

We're 15 minutes away from every single poster on here coming on and saying what a brilliant performance, then a fluke, a mistake and a great finish and it's mainly doom and gloom.

We deserved to lose because we lost our heads.

We didn't deserve to lose because of the performance.

Thought Clarke, Quinn, Reid and Bowery had good games.

The lack of strikers on the bench dodn't cost us the game.

Mal Benning coming on and being absolutely raspberry did. Is that Nigel's fault? Possibly.


Benning is not a midfielder, totally alien to him, he would have been better slotting in at RB and let Perch go into midfield, or LB and McCoughlin into midfield.

Anyway, unbeaten run over, lets see how we react to that.
Or bring young Clarke on who is a right back and put Perch in midfield.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:08 pm

Yes I thought folk were being a bit harsh on Benning who is a left sided player trying to do a right sided job. The game was slipping before the own goal and if anything we needed a quick forward on to discourage Bolton players getting up the pitch.

I think that if the last three games have taught us anything it is that we are very much a confidence side. The break hasn’t done us any favours and I think only Reid has improved from where we left off.

Hopefully we can pick it up again and get back to previous levels. We won’t come up against squads with such quality in depth every week and it was only Bolton’s ability to bring on quality players which won it for them.
Who are you calling pedantic? I resemble that remark!
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:19 pm

Ironically Bolton subbed their two most dangerous players and ended up winning the game.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby yorkshire stag » Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:59 pm

Tippy Tappy Football wrote:Ironically Bolton subbed their two most dangerous players and ended up winning the game.


Maddison always goes off at 60 mins
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Wed Feb 17, 2021 11:01 pm

yorkshire stag wrote:
Tippy Tappy Football wrote:Ironically Bolton subbed their two most dangerous players and ended up winning the game.


Maddison always goes off at 60 mins


He's only started two games for them Dave! :lol:
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby yorkshire stag » Wed Feb 17, 2021 11:44 pm

Tippy Tappy Football wrote:
yorkshire stag wrote:
Tippy Tappy Football wrote:Ironically Bolton subbed their two most dangerous players and ended up winning the game.


Maddison always goes off at 60 mins


He's only started two games for them Dave! :lol:


therfore i’m right :D
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Dan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:30 am

bobbystagsfan wrote:Would we have lost if Quinn went off for Benning? who knows.


No i don't think we would've done.


Tippy Tappy Football wrote:I don't think the bench cost us. I would not have brought Mal Benning on. It is hard for subs to come on and get up to speed in a game. Stephen Quinn was having his best game for the Stags. I would have left him on.


This. Losing that game had nothing to do with what was or wasn't on the bench tonight. We lost it because when Mal came on players didn't know where to go. I know this because it was happening 10 yards in front of me. Also if Benning doesn't come on he's not there to score an own goal. I didn't see any players tiring at all, they were all still up for it, encouraging each other and were on top still. We got undone by a fluke goal which made our heads go down. We then bring Mal on and players didn't know who was playing where. Less than 2 minutes later he is scoring an own goal.

If we don't make any subs we bring home all three points. Simple.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby bobbystagsfan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:30 am

Dan wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:Would we have lost if Quinn went off for Benning? who knows.


No i don't think we would've done.


Tippy Tappy Football wrote:I don't think the bench cost us. I would not have brought Mal Benning on. It is hard for subs to come on and get up to speed in a game. Stephen Quinn was having his best game for the Stags. I would have left him on.


This. Losing that game had nothing to do with what was or wasn't on the bench tonight. We lost it because when Mal came on players didn't know where to go. I know this because it was happening 10 yards in front of me. Also if Benning doesn't come on he's not there to score an own goal. I didn't see any players tiring at all, they were all still up for it, encouraging each other and were on top still. We got undone by a fluke goal which made our heads go down. We then bring Mal on and players didn't know who was playing where. Less than 2 minutes later he is scoring an own goal.

If we don't make any subs we bring home all three points. Simple.



Everyone was screaming for Benning to start over McLaughlin on Facebook too. Benning hasn't looked the same player since Flitcroft was here. Dunno if it's just me, just don't think he's good as he used to be.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby daddycool » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:44 am

We were great for 70 minutes ,and are a match for most teams in in the league . We are not Man City and will lose games . Clough couldn’t get the players he wanted in Jan so why sign for the sake of signing
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby PEAR CIDER » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:47 am

Dan wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:Would we have lost if Quinn went off for Benning? who knows.


No i don't think we would've done.


Tippy Tappy Football wrote:I don't think the bench cost us. I would not have brought Mal Benning on. It is hard for subs to come on and get up to speed in a game. Stephen Quinn was having his best game for the Stags. I would have left him on.


This. Losing that game had nothing to do with what was or wasn't on the bench tonight. We lost it because when Mal came on players didn't know where to go. I know this because it was happening 10 yards in front of me. Also if Benning doesn't come on he's not there to score an own goal. I didn't see any players tiring at all, they were all still up for it, encouraging each other and were on top still. We got undone by a fluke goal which made our heads go down. We then bring Mal on and players didn't know who was playing where. Less than 2 minutes later he is scoring an own goal.

If we don't make any subs we bring home all three points. Simple.


I know you like to disagree for disagree sake but we were simply over run for the last 15mins. We had no bench to offset it. So yes, a weak bench 100% affected the result, when you factor in their impact subs
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby broomo » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:53 am

Dan wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:Would we have lost if Quinn went off for Benning? who knows.


No i don't think we would've done.


Tippy Tappy Football wrote:I don't think the bench cost us. I would not have brought Mal Benning on. It is hard for subs to come on and get up to speed in a game. Stephen Quinn was having his best game for the Stags. I would have left him on.


This. Losing that game had nothing to do with what was or wasn't on the bench tonight. We lost it because when Mal came on players didn't know where to go. I know this because it was happening 10 yards in front of me. Also if Benning doesn't come on he's not there to score an own goal. I didn't see any players tiring at all, they were all still up for it, encouraging each other and were on top still. We got undone by a fluke goal which made our heads go down. We then bring Mal on and players didn't know who was playing where. Less than 2 minutes later he is scoring an own goal.

If we don't make any subs we bring home all three points. Simple.


I'm not buying that Dan. He made one simple change, taking of Quinn who was playing left side of the three central midfielders and brought on Benning to play left side of the 3 in a more defensive role. Which he should be more than capable of playing, he's an experienced senior pro.

There was no change of shape, no switching of other players positions, none of this "bring on a right back and switch Perch into midifeld raspberrys.

He makes simple changes for a reason so as not to confuse or overload the players, they all know their jobs as they've been doing it all game, no need to switch Perch or anyone else who had been handling Bolton all night.

It's the same reason he played Mel left side of midfield last time he came off the bench and left McLoughlin at left back. No need for complicated instructions.

If the players didn't know where they should be playing it's down to them. Nobody told them to change their positions and I think many are over complicating it.

We got done by a total fluke, by a poor clearance and then by not closing down quickly enough. Maybe by that point we'd panicked a little bit and certainly they had momentum but they won a game they weren't in at all.

It wasn't down to a change of formation or players not knowing where they should be.

I do agree with you though that if Quinn stays on we win the game. He may have been tired but we wouldn't have capitulated the way we did.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Jimstag » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:11 am

I’m in agreement that the bench cost us or more that I don’t think Clough is able to rotate any players at the moment if he wished. Just a case of limited options.

I don’t buy the point that you can’t legislate for injuries, we knew how thick and fast the games would be and that would mean injuries and suspensions. You just don’t know which players will be affected.

The objective of the transfer window seemed to me to be to shift some cost and wages and make do, potentially settle for mid-table and maybe get lucky. To be honest I would have taken this when Clough took over and we were in the relegation zone.

In truth I think Bolton got lucky last night, the goal knocked the stuffing out of our players but in the last 15 minutes every shot seemed to fly in. There were at least 2 that had no real right to go in, yes we had one similar but it more than levelled itself out.

As for the comment about stone, I think he looks a decent keeper for this level. Yes if we’re after promotion you want to have the best keeper possible but he’s decent and will hopefully improve as he gains experience. Id like to see him stay in for this season, he’s easily at the similar standard to Stech, Logan and Olejnik for me and is at an age where he’s on the way up rather than those on the way down. He will make mistakes as he’s young but if the objective is mid-table obscurity then let’s give player like him experience, it could come good for next seasons push. Same with Sinclair and maybe another youngster?
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Amber Andy » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:23 am

We need to face the reality that this squad that GC assembled is nowhere near a playoff achieving side. The defence especially needs a lot of improvement.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Stag on the Beach » Thu Feb 18, 2021 9:22 am

Young Tyrese is the baffling one. He has been billed by some as the most promising of the youngsters over the last 2 or 3 years and yet he's left on the bench game after game. Is he not doing it in training? Who knows. Charsley may have been affected by the very early booking, but if he wasn't tracking back, or doing the business at the sharp end, he should have been the one to come off which would at least have offered the opportunity to see what Sinclair can do when it matters.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby BH_Stag » Thu Feb 18, 2021 9:55 am

bobbystagsfan wrote:
Dan wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:Would we have lost if Quinn went off for Benning? who knows.


No i don't think we would've done.


Tippy Tappy Football wrote:I don't think the bench cost us. I would not have brought Mal Benning on. It is hard for subs to come on and get up to speed in a game. Stephen Quinn was having his best game for the Stags. I would have left him on.


This. Losing that game had nothing to do with what was or wasn't on the bench tonight. We lost it because when Mal came on players didn't know where to go. I know this because it was happening 10 yards in front of me. Also if Benning doesn't come on he's not there to score an own goal. I didn't see any players tiring at all, they were all still up for it, encouraging each other and were on top still. We got undone by a fluke goal which made our heads go down. We then bring Mal on and players didn't know who was playing where. Less than 2 minutes later he is scoring an own goal.

If we don't make any subs we bring home all three points. Simple.



Everyone was screaming for Benning to start over McLaughlin on Facebook too. Benning hasn't looked the same player since Flitcroft was here. Dunno if it's just me, just don't think he's good as he used to be.


Nailed on to go to Port Vale in the summer.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby bobbystagsfan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:26 am

BH_Stag wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:
Dan wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:Would we have lost if Quinn went off for Benning? who knows.


No i don't think we would've done.


Tippy Tappy Football wrote:I don't think the bench cost us. I would not have brought Mal Benning on. It is hard for subs to come on and get up to speed in a game. Stephen Quinn was having his best game for the Stags. I would have left him on.


This. Losing that game had nothing to do with what was or wasn't on the bench tonight. We lost it because when Mal came on players didn't know where to go. I know this because it was happening 10 yards in front of me. Also if Benning doesn't come on he's not there to score an own goal. I didn't see any players tiring at all, they were all still up for it, encouraging each other and were on top still. We got undone by a fluke goal which made our heads go down. We then bring Mal on and players didn't know who was playing where. Less than 2 minutes later he is scoring an own goal.

If we don't make any subs we bring home all three points. Simple.



Everyone was screaming for Benning to start over McLaughlin on Facebook too. Benning hasn't looked the same player since Flitcroft was here. Dunno if it's just me, just don't think he's good as he used to be.


Nailed on to go to Port Vale in the summer.


Sir Mal will always be a legend for that goal against them, and I am surprised he didn't get moved on when Pearce etc left too. I wouldn't be surprised if he went to port vale
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Conker » Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:28 am

I’d still start Benning over McLaughlin, run of games he’s a better player.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby bobbystagsfan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:30 am

Conker wrote:I’d still start Benning over McLaughlin, run of games he’s a better player.



After last night's performance from Benning, I don't think he'll be starting soon!
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Sedgwick » Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:42 am

Conker wrote:I’d still start Benning over McLaughlin, run of games he’s a better player.


McLaughlin has been decent the last few games, Benning I thinks time here is up
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:57 am

Clough is loyal to players who genuinely want to be at the club and I’m not sure Mal does. There have been rumours for some time that he wants away and for that reason alone, he will be down the pecking order when there is little difference in ability.
Who are you calling pedantic? I resemble that remark!
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby geoffhill » Thu Feb 18, 2021 11:11 am

Benning not as good as he was.Nver been a great defender.Mclaughlin better at going forward and has played better the ast few games.All their goals came from our right side.
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