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weak bench cost us 3 points

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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Parkinsons Perm » Thu Feb 18, 2021 11:33 am

geoffhill wrote:Benning not as good as he was.Nver been a great defender.Mclaughlin better at going forward and has played better the ast few games.All their goals came from our right side.


And that's because Charsley gives no help whatsoever.
Whether he's under instruction to stay further forward or he's no awareness of the danger? Seeing as Bowery comes deep to help out the left back I'm sure Charsley is expected to do the same.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:29 pm

Mal Benning has been an important player for us but he has never been a good defender and has often failed to pick up his man or got caught out up the pitch at the wrong time. He has had more impact as an attacking left back and he helps get us on the front foot going forward. He did play particularly well with CJ Hamilton as CJ had the speed to get back and cover for him when necessary.

However Mal's effectiveness as an attacking player has gone down in the last two seasons as his final ball or cross has not been good and his poor shooting means that he is not an attacking threat. He has missed some good chances. His main attacking threat last season was his throw ins to Andy Cook who then smashed the ball in from the edge of the area.

I can see why Nigel Clough prefers Stephen McLaughlin as he is quicker on to the ball, more of a genuine goal threat going forward and a better crosser of the ball. He is also a taller player and much better at winning defensive headers although I have noted this season that Mal's heading has improved under Nigel Clough. It's interesting to note Broomo or Bear's point watching Mal for the first time that he takes too long to get the ball out from under his feet which slows play down.

Mal's a great left back to have in the squad. Good left backs are not easy to come by. He could be an expensive back up but I don't think he will be one of our big earners.

Mal will not be happy about being No 2 left back and I am sure his agent will be contacting other clubs to sound them out for potential offers for next season. He told me after a game once that he thought he was on the way out under Steve Evans and was amazed that he was offered a new contract by him (along with Krystian Pearce and Omari Sterling-James). Mal thought it was down to JR that he was offered a new contract. JR always seemed to give him the Chairman's Player of the Season award. Nobody knew at the time though that Steve Evans was planning to leave for Peterborough United.

Mal also said that he had a chance to go to Doncaster Rovers on loan but Steve Evans would not let him go.

Whatever happens to Mal in the future, he has given us great service and I have enjoyed watching him.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby lifestags » Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:37 pm

Charsley got caught trying to help out in midfield, which is the natural thing to do for him. When they went 2 0 down it was like they were playing with 2 wingers on the left side, fresh legs would of helped us defend that better and counter attack as they were playing with no left back.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:56 pm

Harry Charsley came inside to help out the midfield for the first goal which he did not need to do. We had plenty of players in that area. He needed to track the left back Declan John and try and stop the cross.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby yorkshire stag » Thu Feb 18, 2021 1:26 pm

let’s just hope we have two out the three back for this weekend
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Dan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:23 pm

PEAR CIDER wrote:
Dan wrote:
bobbystagsfan wrote:Would we have lost if Quinn went off for Benning? who knows.


No i don't think we would've done.


Tippy Tappy Football wrote:I don't think the bench cost us. I would not have brought Mal Benning on. It is hard for subs to come on and get up to speed in a game. Stephen Quinn was having his best game for the Stags. I would have left him on.


This. Losing that game had nothing to do with what was or wasn't on the bench tonight. We lost it because when Mal came on players didn't know where to go. I know this because it was happening 10 yards in front of me. Also if Benning doesn't come on he's not there to score an own goal. I didn't see any players tiring at all, they were all still up for it, encouraging each other and were on top still. We got undone by a fluke goal which made our heads go down. We then bring Mal on and players didn't know who was playing where. Less than 2 minutes later he is scoring an own goal.

If we don't make any subs we bring home all three points. Simple.


I know you like to disagree for disagree sake but we were simply over run for the last 15mins. We had no bench to offset it. So yes, a weak bench 100% affected the result, when you factor in their impact subs


I only disagree when people are wrong which is what you are ;)
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby bobbystagsfan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:32 pm

Who's to say even if we did have adequate bench that our subs would've nullified Bolton pushing after their fluke?

Not that easy, it's got to be a mentality thing too
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby bear 73 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:33 pm

Looking forward to tippys idea of what went wrong, me i am still in a daze, why players are not expected to play for ninety minutes in a game is a bit baffling.
We played a good Bolton team and was in control for 79 minutes , Quinn was having a good game, but the manager gets information all the time, and brought Quinn off and replaced him with Benning perhaps to put fresh legs into the midfield, Bolton had nothing to lose and just gave it a go, Why Stone lost flight of the ball ??, this got their tails up, why Benning was on the right , again not a clue ???, so we give them 2 goals, and then a shot from 20 yards goes in. The last 2 matches will take some recovering from, but we move on to top pf the league Cambridge were a poor pitch will suit there style of play, but the January transfer window was for the club in a time when prudence is required.
If Bolton's gamble fails, they will be in a mess next season, and they are a much bigger club than us, and bring in a lot more revenue. but dont spend it wisely, even league 1 is poor for a club their size. I feel some have lost our target , stay away from the relegation fight, and we still have a lot to do
Still in shock so much joy, and now disappointment, football what a emotional ride, Man Utd 2-0 up against Everton lost 2-3 happens to the best
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Sneag » Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:38 pm

About a minute before Quinn went off we had a freekick in front of our dug outs. Quinn is down on his haunches & attempt to get forward or take the kick. Next time to ball went out Quinn came off.

He was done in. He's lasted a bit longer with each game, but he's not upto 90minutes yet.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby adamstag » Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:44 pm

Whereas it’s not just down to a limited bench the amount of points we’ve lost from winning positions this season has been criminal -i can’t recall a season like this one.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Dan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:16 pm

bear 73 wrote:Looking forward to tippys idea of what went wrong, me i am still in a daze, why players are not expected to play for ninety minutes in a game is a bit baffling.
We played a good Bolton team and was in control for 79 minutes , Quinn was having a good game, but the manager gets information all the time, and brought Quinn off and replaced him with Benning perhaps to put fresh legs into the midfield, Bolton had nothing to lose and just gave it a go, Why Stone lost flight of the ball ??, this got their tails up, why Benning was on the right , again not a clue ???, so we give them 2 goals, and then a shot from 20 yards goes in. The last 2 matches will take some recovering from, but we move on to top pf the league Cambridge were a poor pitch will suit there style of play, but the January transfer window was for the club in a time when prudence is required.
If Bolton's gamble fails, they will be in a mess next season, and they are a much bigger club than us, and bring in a lot more revenue. but dont spend it wisely, even league 1 is poor for a club their size. I feel some have lost our target , stay away from the relegation fight, and we still have a lot to do
Still in shock so much joy, and now disappointment, football what a emotional ride, Man Utd 2-0 up against Everton lost 2-3 happens to the best


Spot on. As I said if Mal wasn’t on the pitch he doesn’t score the own goal. If you look at their 2nd goal you can see Mal hasn’t a clue where he’s meant to be. He goes to head the corner away which someone else does as they’re marking someone whereas Mal isn’t. Then the ball comes back and he’s in the wrong position facing the wrong way and he goes with his wrong foot. It’s a complete shambles by someone who has only been on the pitch about 90 seconds and doesn’t know what to do. Had he still been on the bench we’d have won.

If we’d still got Cook and Maynard I’d be interested to know who people would’ve brought on. We’re 2-1 up so would you bring a striker on for a striker? It doesn’t make sense. Imagine if we’d have brought Cook or Maynard on and lost 3-2, people would’ve been screaming why did he do that when we were winning, just the same as Colchester.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby oldweststander » Thu Feb 18, 2021 3:24 pm

5pts dropped in the last two games because Nigel either is stubbon and won't change his selected 11 or hejust doesn't trust the pro's on the bench.

He has to change, some of the players were running on empty, two games a week on heavy grounds are taking thier toll, Bowery for one looked tired both against Colchester and Bolton immediately he ran onto the pitch.

Opponents realise we are thin on the ground, tgey throw on 3/4 sets of fresh legs knowing we cannot respond.

As much as I admire Nigel he had a bad January window and that alone, has led to the loss of those points. Every team suffers injuries but their squads number 20 plus, not the 19 we have. You cannot call the two youngsters squad players because Nigel refuses to trust them. A pair of young legs on the pitch for the last ten minutes would have given Bolton something to think about other than to go for a winning goal.

Gotta change your ideas Nigel and give at least one youngster a few minutes when tiredness hits.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Gruff » Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:41 pm

Anybody remember about 4 months ago when this lot wouldn't have scored a goal? We had 2 non-league (at best) striker in Bowery and Reid, Rawson was one of the worst signings we'd made and George Maris didn't deserve a shirt.

If only Cloughie had made sure Burton signed the players they wanted in the transfer window, eh? Why didn't he buy some no hopers to have a stronger bench in January.

We lost a game. We'll learn from it.

It's Project Survival this year, and rebuild for next season. Win a few games and the expectations in this board go through the roof.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby HitchcocksShins » Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:25 pm

Personally I blame whoever sponsored a player in the name of their Cockapoo
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby bobbystagsfan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:27 pm

Gruff wrote:Anybody remember about 4 months ago when this lot wouldn't have scored a goal? We had 2 non-league (at best) striker in Bowery and Reid, Rawson was one of the worst signings we'd made and George Maris didn't deserve a shirt.

If only Cloughie had made sure Burton signed the players they wanted in the transfer window, eh? Why didn't he buy some no hopers to have a stronger bench in January.

We lost a game. We'll learn from it.

It's Project Survival this year, and rebuild for next season. Win a few games and the expectations in this board go through the roof.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:



Great post.

We've been spoiled by Nigel, gone from not being able to buy a win to not losing from 8 games in a row. Nige has set the bar high now for the stagsnet mob
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby PEAR CIDER » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:53 pm

This thread wasnt designed to slag anyone off.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Random Hero » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:54 pm

PEAR CIDER wrote:This thread wasnt designed to slag anyone off.


#witchhunt
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby HitchcocksShins » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:56 pm

PEAR CIDER wrote:This thread wasnt designed to slag anyone off.


raspberry off jebend
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Captain Cunno » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:57 pm

PEAR CIDER wrote:This thread wasnt designed to slag anyone off.

Just a usual stagsnet post Chander.... hijacked and turned into an argument by the usual jebends.
These are my opinions , if you don't like them I have others...
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby oldweststander » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:58 pm

bobbystagsfan wrote:
Gruff wrote:Anybody remember about 4 months ago when this lot wouldn't have scored a goal? We had 2 non-league (at best) striker in Bowery and Reid, Rawson was one of the worst signings we'd made and George Maris didn't deserve a shirt.

If only Cloughie had made sure Burton signed the players they wanted in the transfer window, eh? Why didn't he buy some no hopers to have a stronger bench in January.

We lost a game. We'll learn from it.

It's Project Survival this year, and rebuild for next season. Win a few games and the expectations in this board go through the roof.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:



Great post.

We've been spoiled by Nigel, gone from not being able to buy a win to not losing from 8 games in a row. Nige has set the bar high now for the stagsnet mob


Doesn't change the fact that Nigel made the same mistake two matches in a row with his refusal to bring on fresh legs to match the opposition.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Stoney » Fri Feb 19, 2021 1:10 am

Fully agree with the OP. I'm a huge believer in 'attack is the best form of defence' and we have zero options on the bench. Jamie Reid and Jordan Bowery are running their arses off week in week out, the amount of graft they are putting in can't realistically be maintained twice a week Tuesday and Saturday. Okay I get we are unlucky with the Sarkic injury but I would've still liked to have seen Knowles brought back upon the release of Maynard and Cook.

Once our forwards are inevitably knackered the ball is just going to keep coming back at us.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Upper West » Fri Feb 19, 2021 1:26 am

I do not think it is the strength of the bench but the timing of the substitutions.

I have thought for a long time that a substitution late in the game should only be made in the case of injury. 2 reasons for this. Firstly it takes a while for a sub to get into the game. Secondly if the opposition is pushing for a goal, it gives them chance to have a breather before making a final push.

If you look at any match where a goal has been scored late on there is a good chance that a substitution was made by the opposition a few minutes earlier.

Stags this season

Orient A Sub 90 conceded 92
Newport A sub 84 conceded 88
Bolton A sub 86 conceded 90
Colchester H sub 84 conceded 85
Cheltenham (cup) A sub 108 conceded 110
Colchester A sub 80 conceded 89
Bolton H sub 83 conceded 85
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Dan » Fri Feb 19, 2021 1:38 am

Upper West wrote:I do not think it is the strength of the bench but the timing of the substitutions.

I have thought for a long time that a substitution late in the game should only be made in the case of injury. 2 reasons for this. Firstly it takes a while for a sub to get into the game. Secondly if the opposition is pushing for a goal, it gives them chance to have a breather before making a final push.

If you look at any match where a goal has been scored late on there is a good chance that a substitution was made by the opposition a few minutes earlier.

Stags this season

Orient A Sub 90 conceded 92
Newport A sub 84 conceded 88
Bolton A sub 86 conceded 90
Colchester H sub 84 conceded 85
Cheltenham (cup) A sub 108 conceded 110
Colchester A sub 80 conceded 89
Bolton H sub 83 conceded 85


Imagine where we’d be in the table if we hadn’t made any of those changes!
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby part time pete » Fri Feb 19, 2021 10:27 am

Dan wrote:
Upper West wrote:I do not think it is the strength of the bench but the timing of the substitutions.

I have thought for a long time that a substitution late in the game should only be made in the case of injury. 2 reasons for this. Firstly it takes a while for a sub to get into the game. Secondly if the opposition is pushing for a goal, it gives them chance to have a breather before making a final push.

If you look at any match where a goal has been scored late on there is a good chance that a substitution was made by the opposition a few minutes earlier.

Stags this season

Orient A Sub 90 conceded 92
Newport A sub 84 conceded 88
Bolton A sub 86 conceded 90
Colchester H sub 84 conceded 85
Cheltenham (cup) A sub 108 conceded 110
Colchester A sub 80 conceded 89
Bolton H sub 83 conceded 85


Imagine where we’d be in the table if we hadn’t made any of those changes!


But three of those games, Clough was not even here.
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Re: weak bench cost us 3 points

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Fri Feb 19, 2021 10:36 am

Dan wrote:
Upper West wrote:I do not think it is the strength of the bench but the timing of the substitutions.

I have thought for a long time that a substitution late in the game should only be made in the case of injury. 2 reasons for this. Firstly it takes a while for a sub to get into the game. Secondly if the opposition is pushing for a goal, it gives them chance to have a breather before making a final push.

If you look at any match where a goal has been scored late on there is a good chance that a substitution was made by the opposition a few minutes earlier.

Stags this season

Orient A Sub 90 conceded 92
Newport A sub 84 conceded 88
Bolton A sub 86 conceded 90
Colchester H sub 84 conceded 85
Cheltenham (cup) A sub 108 conceded 110
Colchester A sub 80 conceded 89
Bolton H sub 83 conceded 85


Imagine where we’d be in the table if we hadn’t made any of those changes!


We might not have Nigel Clough as manager. GC did have a bit of bad luck with results. Could easily have beaten Tranmere, Orient, Stevenage and picked up a point against Newport.
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