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Allow Fans to Attend Matches

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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Conker » Thu Oct 08, 2020 11:52 am

I’ve signed it, call me a inconsiderate clown :D

I’m sure the vast majority of football fans are reasonable people, and can see the unjust rules towards certain businesses.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Hjeldefan » Thu Oct 08, 2020 11:55 am

oldweststander wrote:
Hjeldefan wrote:
oldweststander wrote:Just shows there are 174,000 football loving, inconsiderate clowns willing to put their name to a petition which, looking at the bigger picture, has no importance at all in the present pandemic.

How many people do football clubs employ? Pretty sure that those who may lose their job should clubs go bust will think it has a pretty large level of importance.


Providing their mothers, fathers and family have not contracted Covid-19.

Half the problem is the attempt to protect the economy, the other half are those people who refuse to comply with restrictions, can you really see a football stadium being Covid-19 safe?

I totally understand your point, and its incredibly complicated. My own view is that it is incredibly hard to justify no fans when you are allowed to go to a pub, restaurant, cinema etc. A football stadium would (again, my opinion) be far safer than a pub.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby oldweststander » Thu Oct 08, 2020 12:25 pm

Hjeldefan wrote:
oldweststander wrote:
Hjeldefan wrote:
oldweststander wrote:Just shows there are 174,000 football loving, inconsiderate clowns willing to put their name to a petition which, looking at the bigger picture, has no importance at all in the present pandemic.

How many people do football clubs employ? Pretty sure that those who may lose their job should clubs go bust will think it has a pretty large level of importance.


Providing their mothers, fathers and family have not contracted Covid-19.

Half the problem is the attempt to protect the economy, the other half are those people who refuse to comply with restrictions, can you really see a football stadium being Covid-19 safe?

I totally understand your point, and its incredibly complicated. My own view is that it is incredibly hard to justify no fans when you are allowed to go to a pub, restaurant, cinema etc. A football stadium would (again, my opinion) be far safer than a pub.


Have to agree, maybe close those too?
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Big yella » Thu Oct 08, 2020 3:13 pm

chip63 wrote:How does everyone intend to get to the grounds?
Bus train tram etc.. City centre transport would not cope on a Saturday.
We need to think more of what happens outside of grounds before and after the games.
300 going to the cinema is totally different to thousands attending football.

And how do you think 3,000 people (56.9% of capacity) are going to get to the indoor Royal Albert Hall that has been given the go ahead to reopen?
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Big yella » Thu Oct 08, 2020 3:17 pm

Sandy Pate Best Stag wrote:
I am Spartacus wrote:
oldweststander wrote:Just shows there are 174,000 football loving, inconsiderate clowns willing to put their name to a petition which, looking at the bigger picture, has no importance at all in the present pandemic.


And just why are myself and 173,999 others (at least) defined as clowns? For wanting to return to football grounds when the FA and government have deemed it safe to? Safe to watch Clipstone and Belper Town but not Mansfield Town? The petition is asking the current government to rethink backtracking on its thinking regarding so called Elite Sport. It is not a call to spectators to be guinea pigs for herd immunity. Read, if you can or ask your carer to, the recent release from the Brighton GP who states that after the Brighton trial game there was no effect on the figures in the local area.

Football fans, or clowns as you call us, are using government and parliamentary system to effect change. I would hate to hear your opinion of the BLM protestors and anti-lockdown protesters after they also gathered in numbers in public spaces.

The mental well being, community spirit, sense of well being, the benefits to the economy and a sense of a return to normality have a great importance in this current pandemic.

OWS I am afraid that based upon your comments you would fail to be employed in the circus as a clown, dancing horse, lion tamer’s three legged stool or a bearded lady.

Good day to you Sir!!!!


Sparky

The government haven’t deemed it safe to return to league football grounds and have put the return on hold. Surely that is the point of this petition.

I can see the return to small non league grounds backfiring as fans who would normally attend league games flock to small games instead.

Yeah but it’s fine for your hero Bojo and his cronies to attend the Royal Albert Hall in their thousands. So it’s only us plebs that can’t be trusted is it?
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby chip63 » Thu Oct 08, 2020 3:23 pm

Big yella wrote:
chip63 wrote:How does everyone intend to get to the grounds?
Bus train tram etc.. City centre transport would not cope on a Saturday.
We need to think more of what happens outside of grounds before and after the games.
300 going to the cinema is totally different to thousands attending football.

And how do you think 3,000 people (56.9% of capacity) are going to get to the indoor Royal Albert Hall that has been given the go ahead to reopen?


private jets, helicopters, limos etc...
Also can't see them singing or queuing for toilets or food.
Just change the west stand into a bar. Quarry lane into a cinema (tv in corner)
North stand a very slow takeaway selling fresh cooked roast beef dinners while you wait.
Obviously only opened once every 2 weeks for 2/3 hours. ;)

:coys:
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Thu Oct 08, 2020 3:37 pm

Big yella wrote:
Sandy Pate Best Stag wrote:
I am Spartacus wrote:
oldweststander wrote:Just shows there are 174,000 football loving, inconsiderate clowns willing to put their name to a petition which, looking at the bigger picture, has no importance at all in the present pandemic.


And just why are myself and 173,999 others (at least) defined as clowns? For wanting to return to football grounds when the FA and government have deemed it safe to? Safe to watch Clipstone and Belper Town but not Mansfield Town? The petition is asking the current government to rethink backtracking on its thinking regarding so called Elite Sport. It is not a call to spectators to be guinea pigs for herd immunity. Read, if you can or ask your carer to, the recent release from the Brighton GP who states that after the Brighton trial game there was no effect on the figures in the local area.

Football fans, or clowns as you call us, are using government and parliamentary system to effect change. I would hate to hear your opinion of the BLM protestors and anti-lockdown protesters after they also gathered in numbers in public spaces.

The mental well being, community spirit, sense of well being, the benefits to the economy and a sense of a return to normality have a great importance in this current pandemic.

OWS I am afraid that based upon your comments you would fail to be employed in the circus as a clown, dancing horse, lion tamer’s three legged stool or a bearded lady.

Good day to you Sir!!!!


Sparky

The government haven’t deemed it safe to return to league football grounds and have put the return on hold. Surely that is the point of this petition.

I can see the return to small non league grounds backfiring as fans who would normally attend league games flock to small games instead.

Yeah but it’s fine for your hero Bojo and his cronies to attend the Royal Albert Hall in their thousands. So it’s only us plebs that can’t be trusted is it?


Well obviously it’s not alright to re-open the Albert Hall. Nor is it right to spend millions on the elitist arts but that’s an argument for the politics section not here.

In respect of us ‘plebs’ not being trustworthy that is probably correct judging by what has gone on in the past couple of months thus sparking this debate in the first place.

The whole match day experience is about socialising in the pub at the game and back to the pub afterwards for many. The football is secondary to a lot of fans and I don’t think many would go to sit alone and straight home afterwards. Have you ever gone to a game and not had a drink at some point?.

Crowds may not be as large as some expect if there is no social contact and if we open up there will be no subsidy from the PL or government. I doubt they could sell programmes either and would food be table service only? Maybe the profits would’ve be as great as some think especially as the club already have the revenue from season tickets and any extra expense probably wouldn’t be recovered.
Who are you calling pedantic? I resemble that remark!
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Gazmoose82 » Thu Oct 08, 2020 5:44 pm

Sandy Pate Best Stag wrote:
Big yella wrote:
Sandy Pate Best Stag wrote:
I am Spartacus wrote:
oldweststander wrote:Just shows there are 174,000 football loving, inconsiderate clowns willing to put their name to a petition which, looking at the bigger picture, has no importance at all in the present pandemic.


And just why are myself and 173,999 others (at least) defined as clowns? For wanting to return to football grounds when the FA and government have deemed it safe to? Safe to watch Clipstone and Belper Town but not Mansfield Town? The petition is asking the current government to rethink backtracking on its thinking regarding so called Elite Sport. It is not a call to spectators to be guinea pigs for herd immunity. Read, if you can or ask your carer to, the recent release from the Brighton GP who states that after the Brighton trial game there was no effect on the figures in the local area.

Football fans, or clowns as you call us, are using government and parliamentary system to effect change. I would hate to hear your opinion of the BLM protestors and anti-lockdown protesters after they also gathered in numbers in public spaces.

The mental well being, community spirit, sense of well being, the benefits to the economy and a sense of a return to normality have a great importance in this current pandemic.

OWS I am afraid that based upon your comments you would fail to be employed in the circus as a clown, dancing horse, lion tamer’s three legged stool or a bearded lady.

Good day to you Sir!!!!


Sparky

The government haven’t deemed it safe to return to league football grounds and have put the return on hold. Surely that is the point of this petition.

I can see the return to small non league grounds backfiring as fans who would normally attend league games flock to small games instead.

Yeah but it’s fine for your hero Bojo and his cronies to attend the Royal Albert Hall in their thousands. So it’s only us plebs that can’t be trusted is it?


Well obviously it’s not alright to re-open the Albert Hall. Nor is it right to spend millions on the elitist arts but that’s an argument for the politics section not here.

In respect of us ‘plebs’ not being trustworthy that is probably correct judging by what has gone on in the past couple of months thus sparking this debate in the first place.

The whole match day experience is about socialising in the pub at the game and back to the pub afterwards for many. The football is secondary to a lot of fans and I don’t think many would go to sit alone and straight home afterwards. Have you ever gone to a game and not had a drink at some point?.

Crowds may not be as large as some expect if there is no social contact and if we open up there will be no subsidy from the PL or government. I doubt they could sell programmes either and would food be table service only? Maybe the profits would’ve be as great as some think especially as the club already have the revenue from season tickets and any extra expense probably wouldn’t be recovered.


Indeed mate... Let's face it usually the game is the worst part of the day (is for me anyway :lol:) without the social aspect football can be somewhat pointless.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dan » Fri Oct 09, 2020 2:40 pm

oldweststander wrote:
I am Spartacus wrote:
oldweststander wrote:Just shows there are 174,000 football loving, inconsiderate clowns willing to put their name to a petition which, looking at the bigger picture, has no importance at all in the present pandemic.


And just why are myself and 173,999 others (at least) defined as clowns? For wanting to return to football grounds when the FA and government have deemed it safe to? Safe to watch Clipstone and Belper Town but not Mansfield Town? The petition is asking the current government to rethink backtracking on its thinking regarding so called Elite Sport. It is not a call to spectators to be guinea pigs for herd immunity. Read, if you can or ask your carer to, the recent release from the Brighton GP who states that after the Brighton trial game there was no effect on the figures in the local area.

Football fans, or clowns as you call us, are using government and parliamentary system to effect change. I would hate to hear your opinion of the BLM protestors and anti-lockdown protesters after they also gathered in numbers in public spaces.

The mental well being, community spirit, sense of well being, the benefits to the economy and a sense of a return to normality have a great importance in this current pandemic.

OWS I am afraid that based upon your comments you would fail to be employed in the circus as a clown, dancing horse, lion tamer’s three legged stool or a bearded lady.

Good day to you Sir!!!!



My comment was general not a personal attack, obviously yours are, but who cares.

The petition does not mention "when safe to do so".

We will all return "when safe to do so" but currently and in the short to medium term it isn't safe to return, you know that, I know that and surely to God 174,000 know that.

As for groups of protesters BLM or anything else, that should not have been allowed either, but maybe you supported the marches too?


Who decides that though? This government who have made a complete balls up of this whole thing since January? What if it's never ever going to be safe? What if this 'virus' is here for years like the flu is, then what do we do?
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby chip63 » Fri Oct 09, 2020 9:21 pm

Dan wrote:
oldweststander wrote:
I am Spartacus wrote:
oldweststander wrote:Just shows there are 174,000 football loving, inconsiderate clowns willing to put their name to a petition which, looking at the bigger picture, has no importance at all in the present pandemic.


And just why are myself and 173,999 others (at least) defined as clowns? For wanting to return to football grounds when the FA and government have deemed it safe to? Safe to watch Clipstone and Belper Town but not Mansfield Town? The petition is asking the current government to rethink backtracking on its thinking regarding so called Elite Sport. It is not a call to spectators to be guinea pigs for herd immunity. Read, if you can or ask your carer to, the recent release from the Brighton GP who states that after the Brighton trial game there was no effect on the figures in the local area.

Football fans, or clowns as you call us, are using government and parliamentary system to effect change. I would hate to hear your opinion of the BLM protestors and anti-lockdown protesters after they also gathered in numbers in public spaces.

The mental well being, community spirit, sense of well being, the benefits to the economy and a sense of a return to normality have a great importance in this current pandemic.

OWS I am afraid that based upon your comments you would fail to be employed in the circus as a clown, dancing horse, lion tamer’s three legged stool or a bearded lady.

Good day to you Sir!!!!



My comment was general not a personal attack, obviously yours are, but who cares.

The petition does not mention "when safe to do so".

We will all return "when safe to do so" but currently and in the short to medium term it isn't safe to return, you know that, I know that and surely to God 174,000 know that.

As for groups of protesters BLM or anything else, that should not have been allowed either, but maybe you supported the marches too?


Who decides that though? This government who have made a complete balls up of this whole thing since January? What if it's never ever going to be safe? What if this 'virus' is here for years like the flu is, then what do we do?


Think they said 10% of the population will of had it by end of year.
So 10 years from now we might be safe or dead.
I remember the hospitals last Xmas time full to the brim with no beds and patients in corridors with ambulances queuing outside and that was without covid.
It's going to be a very long winter, so not being able to watch football in a stadium is trivial.
Every game for every team is available to watch live.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dan » Fri Oct 09, 2020 9:24 pm

chip63 wrote:
Dan wrote:
oldweststander wrote:
I am Spartacus wrote:
oldweststander wrote:Just shows there are 174,000 football loving, inconsiderate clowns willing to put their name to a petition which, looking at the bigger picture, has no importance at all in the present pandemic.


And just why are myself and 173,999 others (at least) defined as clowns? For wanting to return to football grounds when the FA and government have deemed it safe to? Safe to watch Clipstone and Belper Town but not Mansfield Town? The petition is asking the current government to rethink backtracking on its thinking regarding so called Elite Sport. It is not a call to spectators to be guinea pigs for herd immunity. Read, if you can or ask your carer to, the recent release from the Brighton GP who states that after the Brighton trial game there was no effect on the figures in the local area.

Football fans, or clowns as you call us, are using government and parliamentary system to effect change. I would hate to hear your opinion of the BLM protestors and anti-lockdown protesters after they also gathered in numbers in public spaces.

The mental well being, community spirit, sense of well being, the benefits to the economy and a sense of a return to normality have a great importance in this current pandemic.

OWS I am afraid that based upon your comments you would fail to be employed in the circus as a clown, dancing horse, lion tamer’s three legged stool or a bearded lady.

Good day to you Sir!!!!



My comment was general not a personal attack, obviously yours are, but who cares.

The petition does not mention "when safe to do so".

We will all return "when safe to do so" but currently and in the short to medium term it isn't safe to return, you know that, I know that and surely to God 174,000 know that.

As for groups of protesters BLM or anything else, that should not have been allowed either, but maybe you supported the marches too?


Who decides that though? This government who have made a complete balls up of this whole thing since January? What if it's never ever going to be safe? What if this 'virus' is here for years like the flu is, then what do we do?


Think they said 10% of the population will of had it by end of year.
So 10 years from now we might be safe or dead.
I remember the hospitals last Xmas time full to the brim with no beds and patients in corridors with ambulances queuing outside and that was without covid.
It's going to be a very long winter, so not being able to watch football in a stadium is trivial.
Every game for every team is available to watch live.


You say that, but if you speak to people in the medical profession as well as a lot of those people you talk about who were in hospital you’ll find that the majority of them firmly believe they had Covid last year.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Bradders » Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:20 pm

Dan wrote:You say that, but if you speak to people in the medical profession as well as a lot of those people you talk about who were in hospital you’ll find that the majority of them firmly believe they had Covid last year.

...and they were wrong. I've known a few making that claim, and they either avoided getting an antibody test or they had one and it was negative. I had some bug in January that gave me a bad cough and other symptoms, then Covid in March. I can tell you that Covid is quite different from the infections that were doing the rounds last winter.
Back on topic, people are sceptical about football attendances being possible. Perhaps rightly. But it's wrong to generalise. Some parts of the country have seen steep rises in infections, but the neighbouring areas haven't. Look at the Mansfield area, with lower than average infection rates despite being twenty minutes drive from one of the hotspots of the country. Some areas have had strict measures in place for weeks, but as a result seen a drastic rise in numbers infected. Pointing to a major misunderstanding of how the infection is spread. You'd think that, if it's really down to pubs, Mansfield would be badly hit - it's known for rowdy drinkers and there's no reason to suppose that they have followed protocols better than people in pubs elsewhere.

My point is that assumptions about infection prevention are deeply flawed, and government advice appears arbitrary and ineffective (at best). So what we think we know about stadiums may be 100% incorrect, and in my view there should be a resumption of the experiment with (limited) football attendance, to see whether it really can be proved safe - or not.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dan » Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:52 pm

Bradders wrote:
Dan wrote:You say that, but if you speak to people in the medical profession as well as a lot of those people you talk about who were in hospital you’ll find that the majority of them firmly believe they had Covid last year.

...and they were wrong. I've known a few making that claim, and they either avoided getting an antibody test or they had one and it was negative. I had some bug in January that gave me a bad cough and other symptoms, then Covid in March. I can tell you that Covid is quite different from the infections that were doing the rounds last winter.


How do you know they were wrong? You said you had a bad cough & other symptoms. Well if you were working at a football match like I am tomorrow you have to fill in a form and one of the questions on it is do you have a cough. Others questions ask if you have a temperature, loss of smell/taste, sore throat, sore or red eyes, abdominal pain/diarrhoea, shortness of breath, fatigue, blocked nose or headache!!!!! If I say yes to any of those I’m not allowed in. Now I’m willing to put my house on it that your ‘other symptoms’ will be covered in the above list, because even a normal cold or a simple headache is covered in there. So how do you know you (& others) didn’t have Covid? Simple answer is you don’t. No one really knows when it came to these shores. It’s more than possible it was here in December especially when you think of how many visitors from around the world come to see London at Christmas.

If you are saying you tested positive for Covid then please tell me what the difference was between that & the other thing you had in January.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dave Wayne » Sat Oct 10, 2020 9:30 am

Nottingham University have been reviewing samples taken from people 'pre-Covid' to try and trace how far back the infections actually go in the UK and the earliest evidence they have found of a 'community' transmission - somebody with Covid who hadn't travelled abroad - is an elderly woman in Nottingham who tested positive on 21 February. The people who think they had it in December had flu. If Covid had been in this country in December the number of hospitalised people would have been increasing a lot sooner than March.

On that note, the number of people hospitalised with Covid in England yesterday was higher than when we went into lockdown in March. With that in mind, is it really sensible to allow thousands of people to travel to football matches at the moment ?
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby oldweststander » Sat Oct 10, 2020 9:40 am

Dave Wayne wrote:Nottingham University have been reviewing samples taken from people 'pre-Covid' to try and trace how far back the infections actually go in the UK and the earliest evidence they have found of a 'community' transmission - somebody with Covid who hadn't travelled abroad - is an elderly woman in Nottingham who tested positive on 21 February. The people who think they had it in December had flu. If Covid had been in this country in December the number of hospitalised people would have been increasing a lot sooner than March.

On that note, the number of people hospitalised with Covid in England yesterday was higher than when we went into lockdown in March. With that in mind, is it really sensible to allow thousands of people to travel to football matches at the moment ?



No it isn't.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby cassellswasmagic » Sat Oct 10, 2020 9:47 am

Definitely isn’t !!!
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Jimstag » Sat Oct 10, 2020 9:52 am

I signed it but it’s more a protest against the hypocrisy going on in decision making, i’m not sure if i’d go personally but if the government are allowing larger volumes of people into venues at once then a stadium should be no different.
In fact they are now allowing corporate events for people to watch the game inside on tv at stadia in recent changes, so just like the royal Albert hall or grouse hunting it is one rule for the ‘elite’ and another for us. Therefore i’m using what democratic tools i have to let it be known.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Sat Oct 10, 2020 10:39 am

You only have to look at students to realise how the relaxation of rules can undo all the good work gained by sacrifice throughout the summer.

Latest tests show that in areas of high student population, the virus is 10 times the level of other areas. Now tell me that social mixing is safe and rules should be relaxed.

This country has gone through an unprecedented period of disruption in order to suppress this virus and that disruption has devastated people’s lives and financial well-being. Should we really be throwing away all of that sacrifice and hard work just so that people can go and watch a football match? It’s like building a roof and leaving the ridge tiles off, you have to complete the job or you may as well not have bothered in the first place. And it’s no good shouting what about in order to justify your decision and we should be insisting the other breaches are stopped as well. Whether some like it or not, we are all in this together and must act as one even if we don’t think we will suffer personally.
Who are you calling pedantic? I resemble that remark!
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dan » Sat Oct 10, 2020 11:01 am

Dave Wayne wrote:Nottingham University have been reviewing samples taken from people 'pre-Covid' to try and trace how far back the infections actually go in the UK and the earliest evidence they have found of a 'community' transmission - somebody with Covid who hadn't travelled abroad - is an elderly woman in Nottingham who tested positive on 21 February. The people who think they had it in December had flu. If Covid had been in this country in December the number of hospitalised people would have been increasing a lot sooner than March.


You’re wrong again.

Having created a network using over 1,000 coronavirus genomes, researchers believe the pandemic kicked off some time between September 13 and December 7, and that three different strains have emerged

When did coronavirus first come to the UK?
The first confirmed cases of coronavirus in the UK were on January 29, when two Chinese nationals fell ill at the Staycity Aparthotel in York.





https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/metro.co ... 78061/amp/
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby oldweststander » Sat Oct 10, 2020 11:14 am

Dan wrote:
Dave Wayne wrote:Nottingham University have been reviewing samples taken from people 'pre-Covid' to try and trace how far back the infections actually go in the UK and the earliest evidence they have found of a 'community' transmission - somebody with Covid who hadn't travelled abroad - is an elderly woman in Nottingham who tested positive on 21 February. The people who think they had it in December had flu. If Covid had been in this country in December the number of hospitalised people would have been increasing a lot sooner than March.


You’re wrong again.

Having created a network using over 1,000 coronavirus genomes, researchers believe the pandemic kicked off some time between September 13 and December 7, and that three different strains have emerged

When did coronavirus first come to the UK?
The first confirmed cases of coronavirus in the UK were on January 29, when two Chinese nationals fell ill at the Staycity Aparthotel in York.





https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/metro.co ... 78061/amp/



Dan is correct, the first cases in UK were indeed in York but there is absolutely no trace of the virus before that time so as Dave W says, anyone thinking they had it prior to Christmas didn't have Coronavirus but maybe Flu.

Wasn't thd first UK national a chap from Brighton who had just returned from Italy in February ?
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dave Wayne » Sat Oct 10, 2020 11:21 am

Dan wrote:
Dave Wayne wrote:Nottingham University have been reviewing samples taken from people 'pre-Covid' to try and trace how far back the infections actually go in the UK and the earliest evidence they have found of a 'community' transmission - somebody with Covid who hadn't travelled abroad - is an elderly woman in Nottingham who tested positive on 21 February. The people who think they had it in December had flu. If Covid had been in this country in December the number of hospitalised people would have been increasing a lot sooner than March.


You’re wrong again.

Having created a network using over 1,000 coronavirus genomes, researchers believe the pandemic kicked off some time between September 13 and December 7, and that three different strains have emerged

When did coronavirus first come to the UK?
The first confirmed cases of coronavirus in the UK were on January 29, when two Chinese nationals fell ill at the Staycity Aparthotel in York.





https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/metro.co ... 78061/amp/

How am I wrong ?
I said the first community transmissions - people who caught it in the UK who hadn't travelled abroad.
If you carry on reading that article it quotes a date of February 28th for the first case of a community transmission, a week later than the date I quoted which wasn't discovered until August when the university researched older specimens.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/uk-england-nottinghamshire-53907629

You were claiming that it was probably in the UK in December due to xmas travellers to London, but have now quoted an article saying the first confirmed cases in the UK were at the end of January.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dan » Sat Oct 10, 2020 11:35 am

Have you not read my post above where it says the pandemic kicked off in the UK in September?! :roll:
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Sat Oct 10, 2020 11:43 am

You can’t confirm an infection if you don’t test for it.

If testing didn’t start until February, how can you confirm an infection in December? Anti body testing wasn’t developed until much later and can’t tell when the infection was contracted so I can’t see how you can say the infection 100% wasn’t here earlier.
Who are you calling pedantic? I resemble that remark!
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dave Wayne » Sat Oct 10, 2020 11:55 am

Dan wrote:Have you not read my post above where it says the pandemic kicked off in the UK in September?! :roll:

It doesn't say in the UK. It says the pandemic started in September, not December when China first started reporting cases. It is talking globally at that point.
The same article then goes on to quote the first recorded case in the UK was in late January and the first community transmission in late February.
If it was here in December, or earlier, then our hospitals would have been filling up a lot sooner than March.
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Re: Allow Fans to Attend Matches

Postby Dave Wayne » Sat Oct 10, 2020 12:02 pm

Sandy Pate Best Stag wrote:You can’t confirm an infection if you don’t test for it.

If testing didn’t start until February, how can you confirm an infection in December? Anti body testing wasn’t developed until much later and can’t tell when the infection was contracted so I can’t see how you can say the infection 100% wasn’t here earlier.

Samples that are held of people with covid-like symptoms have been tested by various research groups and no sample has tested positive for Covid from anyone who hadn't travelled abroad prior to the lady whose sample from late February tested positive.
If the virus was here in December in the numbers people are claiming on social media there would be samples that would have tested positive on retesting. This hasn't happened.
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