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Bury FC Courtcase

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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Tue Jul 30, 2019 9:11 pm

There are some great tweets from Andy Holt, Accrington's Chairman, on the Bury and Bolton situations and condemning the lack of proper regulation by the EFL:

"So we have to have a strong rule book set by an #independentregulator to protect clubs from owners. Their key responsibility has to be the stable functioning of the football pyramid. Football cannot self regulate. Business folk do their best to destroy competition. It’s our job.

Don’t leave football to businessmen. Don’t let businessmen set the rules. If you do you’ll get carnage.

The @EFL @premierleague will never do the right thing. They’re private businesses responsible only for their self interest. Owned and run by clubs.

We need to act fast. But we can’t.

Club owners need to be brought together to work out new regulations for @EFL. But we won’t. And if we owners had the desire to change, which we don’t, it’d take years. We only meet twice a year and many owners don’t even bother to attend.

So I’m happy to be described as a knobhead. It’s a reflection of the anger and resentment of the absolute raspberries state we find football in. It’s our fault as owners. Just remember that this KNOBHEAD is the ONLY KNOBHEAD that is trying to get change to protect OUR CLUBS."
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby bellwhiff » Wed Jul 31, 2019 9:50 am

ParisStag wrote:
part time pete wrote:MK Dons just changed their name from Wimbledon FC and moved ground location.

Just like Newton Heath (Manchester United) and Woolwich Arsenal (Arsenal FC) have done in the past.

AFC Wimbledon were formed before Wimbledon moved from south London and did start at the bottom of the pyramid.


Newton Heath and Old Trafford are both in Manchester. Woolwich and Highbury are both in London. Merton and Milton Keynes are 65 miles apart. It's not the same thing.

Winkleman ripped a club away from it's fans and community to give it to a town without a league club. He re-branded, changed the name, kit, etc, but wanted to keep the 1988 FA Cup and league position at the time. The courts declared that AFC Wimbledon were the rightful owners of the Wimbledon legacy and should be given the rights to the club's history and trophies, not MK. As for the people of Milton Keynes, they are not just like the rest of us. They profited directly from the killing of a club and stood by and let it happen by supporting Winkleman's project. He was too greedy and impatient to invest in the existing Milton Keynes non-league club and start lower down. They should all be ashamed of themselves.

This. They stole a club. Vile
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Wed Jul 31, 2019 11:12 am

Bury's winding up petition has been dismissed. Steve Dale just now needs to persuade the EFL that he has the funds to run the club for a season.

I'm a bit disappointed that HMRC have not challenged the CVA. They have effectively written off around £750,000 (75% of the debt) along with the other creditors. I'm still not sure Steve Dale can come up with the cash to pay the other 25% of debts owed to HMRC and other unsecured creditors. If they are not paid then they can petition to have the club would up.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Wed Jul 31, 2019 5:32 pm

Steve Dale has issued another strange statement threatening to take photos of Bury fans who turn up at a protest outside his house on Saturday and issue them with lifetime bans.

"The Chairman has issued the following statement after the winding up petition was dismissed today:

I am pleased to advise our winding up petition from HMRC has been dismissed today, so Bury's legacy continues in the face of adversity. We hope that our ongoing talks with the EFL will allow them to see what we are facing with saving our Club and to please work with us. They are now the only thing stopping Bury’s survival and we implore them to help us.

We still have a lot of hurdles to clear from the former owners, but we're picking them off one by one. We need to get rid of this negativity and unite, we inherited this mess so stop this slander on social media from the few, against those hardworking people at our Club doing 20 hour days to save it. Protesting at my house again, really? Against what? “Saving Bury?” Any more of this disgraceful behaviour and photos of those concerned will be taken, names logged and lifetime bans issued.

Once the EFL lift our embargo, our Club will go from strength to strength and as one, the sweeter it will be.

The war is not over but united as one we can win, rest assured, as our team and management last night proved.

Vincit-Omnia-Industria

Regards

Steven D Dale"
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Wed Jul 31, 2019 5:54 pm

Debbie Jevans of the EFL has said on BBC Radio Manchester that:

1. Bury need to demonstrate that the Bury players have been paid; and

2. The EFL need to see evidence that the club is sustainable and that Bury will be able to complete their fixtures.

She also refuted Steve Dale's statement that the EFL are the only thing standing in Bury's way. She said this was not true. The EFL has requested information but he has not provided it.

The EFL are also having a wider governance review which has been going on for the last 6 months.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live: ... manchester (18.11)
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:30 pm

David Conn's latest article on Bury. The EFL also said that if Bury were expelled then there would be an extra promotion place from League 2 this season.

"Bury still face a threat of being expelled from the Football League after 125 years of membership if the owner, Steve Dale, does not provide the EFL with evidence that he has the funding to pay former players and full-time staff, and to run the club this season. The EFL has suspended the club’s first fixture, against MK Dons on Saturday, stating that Dale has not shown them the required “proof of funds” and that he must provide it by 12 pm on Friday or the scheduled second match, away at Accrington Stanley, will also be suspended. If that does happen, the EFL board will then meet to review Bury’s overall situation and a possible expulsion from the league is among the options it could then consider. If that were to happen, the EFL clarified that League One would be played with 23 rather than 24 clubs and next season an extra club would be promoted from League Two.

Speaking to the Guardian the EFL’s executive chair, Debbie Jevans, said: “We asked for ‘sufficiency of funds’ to demonstrate that Bury can compete, that staff are being paid on and off the pitch. We gave a deadline for that information, it was a real deadline, I spoke to Mr Dale, he was aware of it and, when it didn’t come through, we took the only decision we could. Now we need the information by this Friday or else the Accrington Stanley match will be suspended. And at that point the board will meet to review the future. You can’t go through a whole season one match at a time.”

Dale said in a forthright statement on Tuesday that he had indeed provided the EFL with proof of funds, including to cope as requested with a possible £1.5m loss which he described as “fictional”. But Jevans said that the EFL had asked for evidence that former players – who were part of the squad which won promotion from League Two in May but then revealed they had not been paid since February – have now been paid all the money owing to them.

Full-time staff must now also be paid in full, as they are classed as “football creditors” in any insolvency procedure, such as a company voluntary arrangement (CVA) which Bury entered into last month.

At the time of the CVA, in which Dale committed to paying “non-football creditors” 25p for every pound owed, players were stated to have been owed £405,815, within a total of almost £1m owed to football creditors. No separate category was noted for wages owed to full-time staff.

Jevans said the EFL has also been asking for evidence that: “The club could operate for a season, which means running a stadium, paying players, staff, stewards; we asked for that in very simple terms. Currently we have not received what we have asked for.”

Dale told the Guardian in response that the CVA will be financed and cover the former players’ wages, that he is still in discussions with the EFL over the “mythical £1.5m,” and said that current players have all been paid.

Jevans added that the EFL will reflect on its rules governing takeovers in the light of the crisis at Bury which has followed Dale’s £1 takeover in December, as part of the league’s ongoing review of its governance.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... eague-bury
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby part time pete » Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:33 am

I find it strange that four will still be relegated from League one. If my team finished 20th, normally a safe position, I would be not happy to be relegated.

Does that mean three up from the conference or just one down or just run with 23 in League two.
Can we play Accrington Stanley every week.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Thu Aug 01, 2019 8:37 am

If Bury are expelled then I think 5 teams will be promoted from League 2 Pete but only one will be relegated to the National League.

Will this also mean that the top four are automatically promoted with the play offs being for teams finishing from 5th to 8th?
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby part time pete » Thu Aug 01, 2019 3:01 pm

12.2.1 during any Normal Playing Season, its playing record shall be expunged and the number of relegation places from the relevant Division for that Season shall be reduced by the number of Clubs ceasing to be members;


Looks like only three will be relegated from League One if Bury get thrown out.

So don’t know where tippy got his five promotions from
Can we play Accrington Stanley every week.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Thu Aug 01, 2019 4:40 pm

It came from the EFL in David Conn's article in The Guardian Pete:

"The EFL has suspended the club’s first fixture, against MK Dons on Saturday, stating that Dale has not shown them the required “proof of funds” and that he must provide it by 12 pm on Friday or the scheduled second match, away at Accrington Stanley, will also be suspended.

If that does happen, the EFL board will then meet to review Bury’s overall situation and a possible expulsion from the league is among the options it could then consider. If that were to happen, the EFL clarified that League One would be played with 23 rather than 24 clubs and next season an extra club would be promoted from League Two."
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby The One » Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:10 pm

Hope they end up in Lancs Sunday league, they cheated and cost us promotion.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby part time pete » Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:19 pm

Tippy Tappy Football wrote:It came from the EFL in David Conn's article in The Guardian Pete:

"The EFL has suspended the club’s first fixture, against MK Dons on Saturday, stating that Dale has not shown them the required “proof of funds” and that he must provide it by 12 pm on Friday or the scheduled second match, away at Accrington Stanley, will also be suspended.

If that does happen, the EFL board will then meet to review Bury’s overall situation and a possible expulsion from the league is among the options it could then consider. If that were to happen, the EFL clarified that League One would be played with 23 rather than 24 clubs and next season an extra club would be promoted from League Two."


The EFL rules don’t say that, they say only three relegated and normal promotions
Can we play Accrington Stanley every week.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:43 pm

I suppose Tippy is only repeating what has been reported, so who know She?
Who are you calling pedantic? I resemble that remark!
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Thu Aug 01, 2019 6:05 pm

I know what the rules say Pete although I've always argued there's some wriggle room on the definition of "relevant division" :lol:
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Fri Aug 02, 2019 6:12 pm

A good report by Granada on Bolton and Bury. The EFL are clearly not fit for purpose. Any financial rogue or criminal can buy a football club and the EFL would not be able to stop them.

https://www.itv.com/news/granada/2019-0 ... l-finance/
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby NorthLondonStag » Fri Aug 02, 2019 7:25 pm

There's a good blog here from the Guardian that talks about Bury but is more about supporting lower league teams. The comments below are interesting as well.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/bl ... or-granted
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:53 pm

Bury's game against Accrington Stanley on 10th August has been suspended by the EFL.

How many games are the EFL going to suspend before they expel Bury from the league?

https://accringtonstanley.co.uk/2019/08 ... suspended/
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:03 pm

Last edited by Tippy Tappy Football on Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby marker_mtfc95 » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:17 pm

Surely they be getting kicked out of league soon.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Captain Cunno » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:36 pm

Hope so.
Promoted on money they never had.

No sympathy whatsoever.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:41 pm

Steve Dale's latest rambling statement. The PFA confirming that matters have been agreed does not mean that players have been paid in full. He also does not mention paying the other staff who the EFL says should be treated as football creditors.

"The Chairman has issued the following statement after the Accrington Stanley game was postponed by the EFL:

BURY FOOTBALL CLUB HAVE BEEN TONIGHT DEALT A GRAVE INJUSTICE.

I today have seen the biggest injustice I have ever seen from this alleged body there to help clubs “the EFL.”

Again after submitting all that was asked from the EFL from our Lawyer, we got a call late tonight saying they are postponing our fixture with Accrington Stanley.

Grounds given to our Lawyer from Nick Craig “we want to substantiate some figures that may or may not be correct” we requested what these were as we could answer them there and then, the reply “we will get them to you as soon as we can but we are all at matches this weekend” and so would Bury fans if the EFL played with a straight bat.

Why did they not wait till Monday to again postpone our fixture if something was missing, we have the weekend to get any information to them, but no once again they prove they are clearly “The Destroyer of Clubs” where malice and vindictive actions take precedence over the whole premise of the EFL TO HELP CLUBS.

Let me list below the requirements sent from there Solicitor which we had to comply with, facts in bold, I do this to prevent ambiguity.

1.) Confirmation and evidence that all outstanding sums due to players will (or have been) paid in full to the satisfaction of the EFL and the PFA; THE PFA CONFIRMED TO THE EFL THAT THIS HAD BEEN AGREED TO THE SATISFACTION OF BOTH PARTIES.

2.) Receipt of written evidence of a bank account with £1.5m in it or a guaranteed line of credit for this amount freely available to the Club (and not any third party) which will allow the Club to operate in the 2019/2020 season; A LETTER OF CREDIT WAS GIVEN TODAY FOR £1.65M.

3.) A certificate/email confirming that the SAG has approved that the Stadium is fit for purpose and that all the necessary plans are in place for the 2019/2020 season; THEY WERE DONE BEFORE THEIR LAST STATEMENT.

ALL THE ABOVE I CAN PROVE AND BACK UP 100%.

I could've gone into the ill truths last time, that tried to discredit me and can disprove any allegations about me, but this beats them all, the deal was struck with our Lawyer and we were just waiting for them to say all is good so we can sign our players who 100% want to play for Bury and have waited patiently, the EFL are aware these players will have to sign elsewhere and seem to be dragging this out till we lose them as nobody expected us to save Bury never mind get players signing of the calibre we have so clearly there is an agenda here, I was told tonight by Debbie Jevans when I said just let us sign our team please before we lose them, the reply “you can play with your youth”, I REST MY CASE.

Regards,

Steven D Dale"
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby cassellswasmagic » Sat Aug 03, 2019 6:20 am

Tippy Tappy Football wrote:

5 promoted from league 2!!! Surely not.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby bellwhiff » Sat Aug 03, 2019 6:32 am

They were promoted on a false agenda. They cheated.

Bye.
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby ST4GS » Sat Aug 03, 2019 7:54 am

cassellswasmagic wrote:
Tippy Tappy Football wrote:

5 promoted from league 2!!! Surely not.

Can they play in the League Cup?
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Re: Bury FC Courtcase

Postby The One » Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:17 am

bellwhiff wrote:They were promoted on a false agenda. They cheated.

Bye.


Agree. Cost us promotion. Put them Lancs Sunday league
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