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Flitcroft IN or OUT?

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Flitcroft in or out?

In - give him time with his own team
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Out - he's had his shot and blown it.
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Total votes : 229

Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby gazza1988 » Sun May 06, 2018 7:07 pm

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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Stags 2002 » Sun May 06, 2018 7:25 pm

Can we have one pre and post the retention list?

A well thought of list may get people on board, equally keeping the likes of Spencer, not putting Angol on the transfer list etc may potentially fuel the fire for those sat on the fence.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Amber Andy » Sun May 06, 2018 7:34 pm

Someone's got to sort the mess SE has left us in. May as well be DF. He's had a few weeks to know what is needed. A new man would only have pre season to assess the problem.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby gazza1988 » Sun May 06, 2018 7:47 pm

I can't see why we can't have one after retained list. Perhaps with 2 more options. So:

1. OUT - my opinion has not changed
2. OUT - I voted IN but after the retained list he should go
3. IN - I voted out but the retained list has changed my mind.
4. IN - My opinion has not changed
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Herts Stag » Sun May 06, 2018 7:48 pm

Sorry, the man is clueless. Anyone who changes his starting 11 after 30 minutes does not know his players or what he is doing. He has to go because he has shown he is not capable of being a manager. The players don't just become disjointed overnight. Tactics come from the manager.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby bobbystagsfan » Sun May 06, 2018 7:54 pm

Herts Stag wrote:Sorry, the man is clueless. Anyone who changes his starting 11 after 30 minutes does not know his players or what he is doing. He has to go because he has shown he is not capable of being a manager. The players don't just become disjointed overnight. Tactics come from the manager.



at least he fixed it, we created boat loads of chances. enough to win two games, but it's not his fault barely anyone other than hemmings and rose can score
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby gazza1988 » Sun May 06, 2018 7:57 pm

Herts Stag wrote:Sorry, the man is clueless. Anyone who changes his starting 11 after 30 minutes does not know his players or what he is doing. He has to go because he has shown he is not capable of being a manager. The players don't just become disjointed overnight. Tactics come from the manager.


From what I can gather he knows 2 players, Rose and Mellis. Rose, he sold to us from Bury. Mellis he worked with during his time at Barnsley.

Like you say though "he doesn't know his players". Do you think that might be because they aren't his players? Evans had months, years in some cases, with these players. Seeing them most days and speaking to them, or with his assistant. Flitcroft hasn't had that luxury.

The only time Evans kept the starting XI the same we lost 2 on the bounce, Evans never knew his best team either.

I'd like to make a comparison of Evans squad with an old banger car. You know the on that you had to perform a routine to get it started and knew how to keep it running. Now Flitcroft has come in he couldn't figure out how to get it going. He managed to get it going but it misfired terribly.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Never easy » Sun May 06, 2018 8:13 pm

OUT OUT OUY Correct me if I’m wrong but is it not a results based buissness . Look repeat look st his record here .shocking also not won at home he had dramatically pulled defeat from the jaws of victory and if anyone swallows his rubbish he spouts is beyond me galvanise energise 1 million %. Did any of these happen in last 12 games ???? Mr Radford call trading standard because it’s. It happening what it says on the tin !!!!!!
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Never easy » Sun May 06, 2018 8:15 pm

Not happening !!
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Stags 2002 » Sun May 06, 2018 8:34 pm

gazza1988 wrote:I can't see why we can't have one after retained list. Perhaps with 2 more options. So:

1. OUT - my opinion has not changed
2. OUT - I voted IN but after the retained list he should go
3. IN - I voted out but the retained list has changed my mind.
4. IN - My opinion has not changed


Spot on :thumbup:
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Expat Stag » Sun May 06, 2018 8:44 pm

In

Can't judge him fairly until he's had at least one window to bring his own players in. Whether via using your eyes or by squawka/opta stats.
Hope I'm wrong
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Amber Andy » Sun May 06, 2018 8:45 pm

Never easy wrote:OUT OUT OUY Correct me if I’m wrong but is it not a results based buissness . Look repeat look st his record here .shocking also not won at home he had dramatically pulled defeat from the jaws of victory and if anyone swallows his rubbish he spouts is beyond me galvanise energise 1 million %. Did any of these happen in last 12 games ???? Mr Radford call trading standard because it’s. It happening what it says on the tin !!!!!!

Given time I wouldn't be at all surprised if the rubbish as you call it is true. I know a Rotherham fan and he told me what a mess they were in after SE left. Has that been repeated here ? Only time will tell.
Last edited by Amber Andy on Sun May 06, 2018 8:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby EdwinstoweStag » Sun May 06, 2018 8:45 pm

In!

and don’t be daft.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby spanishstag » Sun May 06, 2018 8:56 pm

In not a doubt hes the new messiah
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby gazza1988 » Sun May 06, 2018 9:23 pm

So after 4 hrs it's 31-26 IN.

(this is just to keep the thread at the top of the board)
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Sun May 06, 2018 9:23 pm

I normally stay fairly loyal to managers so my natural answer would be in. However, I feel utterly despondent and let down by how this season imploded at a vital stage which has knocked my confidence out of the park.

I've seen nothing to indicate that Mr Flitcroft knows how to motivate and direct a group of players to consistently win games. He has shown the tactict of trying to defend a lead by pulling everyone back and inviting teams on even when the opposition is poor quality. This never encourages me to have faith and in my opinion is an entirely negative and dangerous strategy.

In short, I have lost all confidence that Mr Flitcroft can put a team together to take us up. I want success and like any spoils child I want it as soon as possible. What I don't want is another season of under achievement which could also serve to undermine the commitment of the Radford's.

So on ballance, I say 'thank you, you've had your chance but no thank you'.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby gazza1988 » Sun May 06, 2018 9:34 pm

Sandy Pate Best Stag wrote:I normally stay fairly loyal to managers so my natural answer would be in. However, I feel utterly despondent and let down by how this season imploded at a vital stage which has knocked my confidence out of the park.

I've seen nothing to indicate that Mr Flitcroft knows how to motivate and direct a group of players to consistently win games. He has shown the tactict of trying to defend a lead by pulling everyone back and inviting teams on even when the opposition is poor quality. This never encourages me to have faith and in my opinion is an entirely negative and dangerous strategy.

In short, I have lost all confidence that Mr Flitcroft can put a team together to take us up. I want success and like any spoils child I want it as soon as possible. What I don't want is another season of under achievement which could also serve to undermine the commitment of the Radford's.

So on ballance, I say 'thank you, you've had your chance but no thank you'.


I would absolutely agree had he signed the players. 100%.

A different manager at this point would make no difference to the outcome of the season. A different manager would still want to bring in his own players.

I'd wager that a new manager would cost us more than just keeping DF on. He'd have a higher turnover of players. Who would we even get? Flitcroft ticked a lot of the boxes we look for in a manager. 12 games with someone else's floppers is not a fair judgement. Billy McEwan got a longer tenure and he singed his players.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Sun May 06, 2018 10:00 pm

gazza1988 wrote:
Sandy Pate Best Stag wrote:I normally stay fairly loyal to managers so my natural answer would be in. However, I feel utterly despondent and let down by how this season imploded at a vital stage which has knocked my confidence out of the park.

I've seen nothing to indicate that Mr Flitcroft knows how to motivate and direct a group of players to consistently win games. He has shown the tactict of trying to defend a lead by pulling everyone back and inviting teams on even when the opposition is poor quality. This never encourages me to have faith and in my opinion is an entirely negative and dangerous strategy.

In short, I have lost all confidence that Mr Flitcroft can put a team together to take us up. I want success and like any spoils child I want it as soon as possible. What I don't want is another season of under achievement which could also serve to undermine the commitment of the Radford's.

So on ballance, I say 'thank you, you've had your chance but no thank you'.


I would absolutely agree had he signed the players. 100%.

A different manager at this point would make no difference to the outcome of the season. A different manager would still want to bring in his own players.

I'd wager that a new manager would cost us more than just keeping DF on. He'd have a higher turnover of players. Who would we even get? Flitcroft ticked a lot of the boxes we look for in a manager. 12 games with someone else's floppers is not a fair judgement. Billy McEwan got a longer tenure and he singed his players.


Garza I see that logic and would normally concede. However, I don't see any prospect of Mr Flitcroft learning from his mistakes and changing. His tacticts are negative and he clearly gets selections wrong and plays people out of position.

By changing managers at this point it will allow the new man to build his team and save money in the long run. Failure to do so would waste money on a team that would change with the next manager anyway. If we don't get rid now, he should stay for the full season and we can pray he doesn't take us back to the hell of non league.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby gazza1988 » Sun May 06, 2018 10:14 pm

There is nothing stopping the new manager from relegating us too. This is the worst part. We don't know. There's no way of actually telling that we wouldn't still be a league 2 club next season had Evans stuck around.

There's no way of telling, I get it the fear of returning to the pit of misery is rife in some and want Flitcroft gone because his results so far has been relegation form. I completely get that. With his own players he's got Bury promoted and had Swindon in the play off position when he left.

It really wouldn't surprise me if Evans engineered the move himself. Peterbrough were 1 point outside the play offs when Evans took over. I'm nit privy to Peterborough but that doesn't seem a stackable offence to me. I think Evans had been contacted by fry (probably for stags tickets :lol:) to take over them. Evans said no but then saw our run and knew what was coming and jumped ship before it sank.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby CalderwoodsLeftFoot » Sun May 06, 2018 10:29 pm

So he was given one of the biggest budgets at Swindon and with his own back room Team and players the club have finished ninth . So he moves to a club that alongside Swindon has provided him with a similar budget although I appreciate they aren’t his players . But if he is a great manager he should be able to get the best from most players. He was provided with another quality squad and If I was compiling an end of season report it would be along the lines that he needs to try harder. Both teams have invested heavily and he has been given the best tools for the job and failed on both accounts. I can’t see him taking us up unfortunately. I wouldn’t give him any money to waste!
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Rob » Sun May 06, 2018 10:33 pm

So clearly those who think the manager should get a chance with his own players are not in the "tiny" minority. Its quite heartening we have so many fair minded fans.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby thisyear » Sun May 06, 2018 11:26 pm

In he needs time to get the players that want to play for mtfc and own that shirt
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby bellwhiff » Mon May 07, 2018 7:31 am

Rob wrote:So clearly those who think the manager should get a chance with his own players are not in the "tiny" minority. Its quite heartening we have so many fair minded fans.


And that’s just on here where the atmosphere is febrile and not indicative of the general view.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby gazza1988 » Mon May 07, 2018 8:05 am

CalderwoodsLeftFoot wrote:So he was given one of the biggest budgets at Swindon and with his own back room Team and players the club have finished ninth . So he moves to a club that alongside Swindon has provided him with a similar budget although I appreciate they aren’t his players . But if he is a great manager he should be able to get the best from most players. He was provided with another quality squad and If I was compiling an end of season report it would be along the lines that he needs to try harder. Both teams have invested heavily and he has been given the best tools for the job and failed on both accounts. I can’t see him taking us up unfortunately. I wouldn’t give him any money to waste!


Swindon was in the play offs though. Swapping manager at that point in the season derailed them as it did us.

If I remember right, when Evans arrived he only won 2 of his 6 or 7 league games before he could sign his own players. I think that also included the heavy 5-2 loss at Carlisle (there was 8 games but one was the trophy which is generally greeted with apathy)

In fact I just checked. He had 7 league games before January window and gained 8 points. You can swing this 2 ways, comparing Flitcroft 1st 7 games and you get 3 points from 7 games, but if you take Flitcroft last 7 games berofe the transfer window it's 9 points out of 7.

See at the end of the day Flitcroft is here to stay. May as well give the bloke a chance and reserve judgement. Don't need constant negativity. There was so many times during Evans reign that I thought the fan base would implode (based on history) at certain dings and it didn't. It allowed him the time. Now it feels we are back in the old day where everything is useless unless repeatedly proven otherwise. The old csrtain players are only as good as their last bad game.
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Re: Flitcroft IN or OUT?

Postby Sandy Pate Best Stag » Mon May 07, 2018 8:16 am

gazza1988 wrote:
CalderwoodsLeftFoot wrote:So he was given one of the biggest budgets at Swindon and with his own back room Team and players the club have finished ninth . So he moves to a club that alongside Swindon has provided him with a similar budget although I appreciate they aren’t his players . But if he is a great manager he should be able to get the best from most players. He was provided with another quality squad and If I was compiling an end of season report it would be along the lines that he needs to try harder. Both teams have invested heavily and he has been given the best tools for the job and failed on both accounts. I can’t see him taking us up unfortunately. I wouldn’t give him any money to waste!


Swindon was in the play offs though. Swapping manager at that point in the season derailed them as it did us.

If I remember right, when Evans arrived he only won 2 of his 6 or 7 league games before he could sign his own players. I think that also included the heavy 5-2 loss at Carlisle (there was 8 games but one was the trophy which is generally greeted with apathy)

In fact I just checked. He had 7 league games before January window and gained 8 points. You can swing this 2 ways, comparing Flitcroft 1st 7 games and you get 3 points from 7 games, but if you take Flitcroft last 7 games berofe the transfer window it's 9 points out of 7.

See at the end of the day Flitcroft is here to stay. May as well give the bloke a chance and reserve judgement. Don't need constant negativity. There was so many times during Evans reign that I thought the fan base would implode (based on history) at certain dings and it didn't. It allowed him the time. Now it feels we are back in the old day where everything is useless unless repeatedly proven otherwise. The old csrtain players are only as good as their last bad game.


Gazza the question was should Flitcroft be in or out and had nothing to do with how we should treat him as he is staying anyway. Of course we will all get behind him and the team if he stays but that's not what we are voting on.

I suppose the question boils down to how confident we are of success under Mr Flitcroft. I am not at all confident and that's why I vote for him to go. That may be a tad harsh but football success is not about fairness, it's about results and Mr Flitcrofts are relegation results - simples.
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