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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby EdwinstoweStag » Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:31 pm

Maybe he’s being retained until Mick McCarthy arrives?
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby tillydog123 » Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:42 pm

Nice rumour to start Edwinstowe lad!!
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby EdwinstoweStag » Mon Apr 09, 2018 3:51 pm

tillydog123 wrote:Nice rumour to start Edwinstowe lad!!


I don’t like to keep hot news to myself Tilly boy!
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby adamstag » Mon Apr 09, 2018 4:34 pm

He is from Barnsley ;) :lol:
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby EdwinstoweStag » Mon Apr 09, 2018 5:10 pm

adamstag wrote:He is from Barnsley ;) :lol:


And .....
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Rob » Mon Apr 09, 2018 6:44 pm

Terry Eccles Was God wrote:I don’t dislike him, but seven games in now and we still haven’t won seems a long time ago since we stuffed Newport 5-0 and beat Exeter away in Feb just before Evans shafted us. Of course, the players who were top four were really sub standard all along though, if you subscribe to the reinventing of history theory.


I subscribe to the see it with my own eyes theory, as we discussed many times, I was not impressed with our lack of style and whilst we were hard to beat, it was pretty dull to watch. We'll never know where we'd be now if Evans had stayed, but he left just before we played County, Luton, Accrington & Lincoln, based on what we saw against Cov I have no reason to think our results against those 4 would have been any better. FGR and Crewe have, it has to be said, been hugely disappointing, the much vaunted players have let their manager down. Was it Flitcrofts fault Diamond played like he'd never seen a football?

Clearly those who rate Evans will say he would have had us winning the league by now, I think we'd have made the play-offs, which would have been a bang average return for the money he was given. We still might.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Tippy Tappy Football » Mon Apr 09, 2018 7:14 pm

We would not have lost against FGR, Accrington, Luton and Crewe if Steve Evans had been in charge. One thing Steve Evans did was make us hard to beat even though we often only turned up for one half which has been our main problem most of the season. Steve Evans' high tempo pressing game was also good to watch when it worked even though there was often a lack of creativity and a failure to take the few chances that were created. We were also sometimes guilty of having no Plan B and being too direct when chasing games. He also failed completely to work on set pieces where lots of goals are scored. I think Luton, Notts County and Wycombe have scored over 20 goals each from set pieces and Lincoln can't be far behind.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby edwinscott » Mon Apr 09, 2018 7:18 pm

All of this shows that we have some bad apples in the ranks, will turn up for games for Evans but down tools for flitcroft. Rather than a squad of 22 we need 16-18 of better quality and then 5 from under 21s next season
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Terry Eccles Was God » Mon Apr 09, 2018 7:36 pm

I’m judging Flitcroft on his record now and it’s just not good enough. I do hope it improves, but he has been an absolute disaster so far.

The seven league games before Flitcroft arrived were 5 wins, 1 draw and 1 defeat = auto promotion form.

With the same players Flitcroft in his seven games has achieved 0 wins, 3 draws and 4 defeats = bottom of the league form.

JR would have apppointed him as he thought he had the experience to get us over the line. He has fallen woefully short.

Continually blaming only the players and undermining their previous achievements is a disingenuous way to blur the issue that the new manager has failed spectacularly to date and I do think that our hatred of Evans is clouding people’s judgement with regards to Flitcroft.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby spanishstag » Mon Apr 09, 2018 7:52 pm

I think im a reasonable sort of bloke who if you asked would i be prepared to miss out this season ,and look forward to a manager who will bring on the youth ,play the right way and not bring our club into disrepute every week by his ranting ,then yes ,give me flitcroft every time , lets give him a chance
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby EdwinstoweStag » Mon Apr 09, 2018 8:03 pm

spanishstag wrote:I think im a reasonable sort of bloke who if you asked would i be prepared to miss out this season ,and look forward to a manager who will bring on the youth ,play the right way and not bring our club into disrepute every week by his ranting ,then yes ,give me flitcroft every time , lets give him a chance


With you there.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Vice President » Mon Apr 09, 2018 8:42 pm

This 'obsession with youth' will not get us promoted in the forseeable future! ...... Just ask Accrington, Luton, Wycombe, Plymouth, Portsmouth, AFC wimbledon, (or even the likes of Exeter, County & Lincoln - one of which will probably get there).
I appreciate that we have some promising youngsters - but there is a significant gap between the men's & boy's game. We might be able to bring one or two youngsters into the first team over the next 12-24 months, but teams that get promoted from league 2 are primarily based on experience & proven quality at the league level.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby I am Spartacus » Mon Apr 09, 2018 8:48 pm

EdwinstoweStag wrote:
spanishstag wrote:I think im a reasonable sort of bloke who if you asked would i be prepared to miss out this season ,and look forward to a manager who will bring on the youth ,play the right way and not bring our club into disrepute every week by his ranting ,then yes ,give me flitcroft every time , lets give him a chance


With you there.


Spot on my ‘donkey throwing off of a church roof’ friend. Let’s take the time to build for the future, a long term future for a better club.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Bridgford Stag » Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:25 pm

Vice President wrote:This 'obsession with youth' will not get us promoted in the forseeable future! ...... Just ask Accrington, Luton, Wycombe, Plymouth, Portsmouth, AFC wimbledon, (or even the likes of Exeter, County & Lincoln - one of which will probably get there).
I appreciate that we have some promising youngsters - but there is a significant gap between the men's & boy's game. We might be able to bring one or two youngsters into the first team over the next 12-24 months, but teams that get promoted from league 2 are primarily based on experience & proven quality at the league level.


Quite right.

Youngsters can come into a team for immediate impact but ,with due respect, they will get found out by cleverer opposition players. At which point confidence goes by the wayside?

'Kids' need nurturing and not not thrown in on the 'sink or swim' mantra.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Bradders » Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:36 pm

Rob wrote:
Terry Eccles Was God wrote:I don’t dislike him, but seven games in now and we still haven’t won seems a long time ago since we stuffed Newport 5-0 and beat Exeter away in Feb just before Evans shafted us. Of course, the players who were top four were really sub standard all along though, if you subscribe to the reinventing of history theory.


I subscribe to the see it with my own eyes theory, as we discussed many times, I was not impressed with our lack of style and whilst we were hard to beat, it was pretty dull to watch. We'll never know where we'd be now if Evans had stayed, but he left just before we played County, Luton, Accrington & Lincoln, based on what we saw against Cov I have no reason to think our results against those 4 would have been any better. FGR and Crewe have, it has to be said, been hugely disappointing, the much vaunted players have let their manager down. Was it Flitcrofts fault Diamond played like he'd never seen a football?

Clearly those who rate Evans will say he would have had us winning the league by now, I think we'd have made the play-offs, which would have been a bang average return for the money he was given. We still might.

We were top of the form league based on the last 7 games after the Coventry match, Rob. It seems bizarre to conclude on the basis of one of those matches that we were going to get beaten in virtually all of the subsequent games and have the worst recent record in the league by April. Although I don't know why I bother arguing, as you're not the sort to change your opinion based on logic! All the teams in this league have had indifferent performances from time to time, so picking on one match is pointless. Clearly we were the best team in the league at the end of February, having the best recent record and having beaten several other contenders.

It's OK to say that you hate Steve Evans and hate his style of management and football, but to argue that his results were poor or that he's not a good manager ("a bang average return for the money he was given"!) is just daft. Since when has assumed future performance based on the opposite of current performance been a valid method of assessing someone?

He's plainly a very good manager that gets results. I wouldn't sign him for my club (if I had one), but that's not because he can't manage a team.

If I'd signed Flitcroft to continue the good work and he'd guided the successful team to relegation form I wouldn't be blaming the previous manager or the players. He'd know what he was taking on, and would have claimed that he'd at least come close to continuing in the same vein. As a manager, Flitcroft can't blame the squad - it's a big part of the job to bring out the best in what you have, and the squad is very much proven at this level.

I think that with Evans in charge we'd now be 9 points better off and with the remaining games being fairly amenable, still in with a good chance of automatic promotion.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Terry Eccles Was God » Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:26 pm

Bradders wrote:
Rob wrote:
Terry Eccles Was God wrote:I don’t dislike him, but seven games in now and we still haven’t won seems a long time ago since we stuffed Newport 5-0 and beat Exeter away in Feb just before Evans shafted us. Of course, the players who were top four were really sub standard all along though, if you subscribe to the reinventing of history theory.


I subscribe to the see it with my own eyes theory, as we discussed many times, I was not impressed with our lack of style and whilst we were hard to beat, it was pretty dull to watch. We'll never know where we'd be now if Evans had stayed, but he left just before we played County, Luton, Accrington & Lincoln, based on what we saw against Cov I have no reason to think our results against those 4 would have been any better. FGR and Crewe have, it has to be said, been hugely disappointing, the much vaunted players have let their manager down. Was it Flitcrofts fault Diamond played like he'd never seen a football?

Clearly those who rate Evans will say he would have had us winning the league by now, I think we'd have made the play-offs, which would have been a bang average return for the money he was given. We still might.

We were top of the form league based on the last 7 games after the Coventry match, Rob. It seems bizarre to conclude on the basis of one of those matches that we were going to get beaten in virtually all of the subsequent games and have the worst recent record in the league by April. Although I don't know why I bother arguing, as you're not the sort to change your opinion based on logic! All the teams in this league have had indifferent performances from time to time, so picking on one match is pointless. Clearly we were the best team in the league at the end of February, having the best recent record and having beaten several other contenders.

It's OK to say that you hate Steve Evans and hate his style of management and football, but to argue that his results were poor or that he's not a good manager ("a bang average return for the money he was given"!) is just daft. Since when has assumed future performance based on the opposite of current performance been a valid method of assessing someone?

He's plainly a very good manager that gets results. I wouldn't sign him for my club (if I had one), but that's not because he can't manage a team.

If I'd signed Flitcroft to continue the good work and he'd guided the successful team to relegation form I wouldn't be blaming the previous manager or the players. He'd know what he was taking on, and would have claimed that he'd at least come close to continuing in the same vein. As a manager, Flitcroft can't blame the squad - it's a big part of the job to bring out the best in what you have, and the squad is very much proven at this level.

I think that with Evans in charge we'd now be 9 points better off and with the remaining games being fairly amenable, still in with a good chance of automatic promotion.


:good_post:
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Woodclanger 1 » Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:31 pm

Terry Eccles Was God wrote:
Bradders wrote:
Rob wrote:
Terry Eccles Was God wrote:I don’t dislike him, but seven games in now and we still haven’t won seems a long time ago since we stuffed Newport 5-0 and beat Exeter away in Feb just before Evans shafted us. Of course, the players who were top four were really sub standard all along though, if you subscribe to the reinventing of history theory.


I subscribe to the see it with my own eyes theory, as we discussed many times, I was not impressed with our lack of style and whilst we were hard to beat, it was pretty dull to watch. We'll never know where we'd be now if Evans had stayed, but he left just before we played County, Luton, Accrington & Lincoln, based on what we saw against Cov I have no reason to think our results against those 4 would have been any better. FGR and Crewe have, it has to be said, been hugely disappointing, the much vaunted players have let their manager down. Was it Flitcrofts fault Diamond played like he'd never seen a football?

Clearly those who rate Evans will say he would have had us winning the league by now, I think we'd have made the play-offs, which would have been a bang average return for the money he was given. We still might.

We were top of the form league based on the last 7 games after the Coventry match, Rob. It seems bizarre to conclude on the basis of one of those matches that we were going to get beaten in virtually all of the subsequent games and have the worst recent record in the league by April. Although I don't know why I bother arguing, as you're not the sort to change your opinion based on logic! All the teams in this league have had indifferent performances from time to time, so picking on one match is pointless. Clearly we were the best team in the league at the end of February, having the best recent record and having beaten several other contenders.

It's OK to say that you hate Steve Evans and hate his style of management and football, but to argue that his results were poor or that he's not a good manager ("a bang average return for the money he was given"!) is just daft. Since when has assumed future performance based on the opposite of current performance been a valid method of assessing someone?

He's plainly a very good manager that gets results. I wouldn't sign him for my club (if I had one), but that's not because he can't manage a team.

If I'd signed Flitcroft to continue the good work and he'd guided the successful team to relegation form I wouldn't be blaming the previous manager or the players. He'd know what he was taking on, and would have claimed that he'd at least come close to continuing in the same vein. As a manager, Flitcroft can't blame the squad - it's a big part of the job to bring out the best in what you have, and the squad is very much proven at this level.

I think that with Evans in charge we'd now be 9 points better off and with the remaining games being fairly amenable, still in with a good chance of automatic promotion.


:good_post:


Quality post, over to you Rob :lol:
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Amber Andy » Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:47 am

Rob wrote:
Terry Eccles Was God wrote:I don’t dislike him, but seven games in now and we still haven’t won seems a long time ago since we stuffed Newport 5-0 and beat Exeter away in Feb just before Evans shafted us. Of course, the players who were top four were really sub standard all along though, if you subscribe to the reinventing of history theory.


I subscribe to the see it with my own eyes theory, as we discussed many times, I was not impressed with our lack of style and whilst we were hard to beat, it was pretty dull to watch. We'll never know where we'd be now if Evans had stayed, but he left just before we played County, Luton, Accrington & Lincoln, based on what we saw against Cov I have no reason to think our results against those 4 would have been any better. FGR and Crewe have, it has to be said, been hugely disappointing, the much vaunted players have let their manager down. Was it Flitcrofts fault Diamond played like he'd never seen a football?

Clearly those who rate Evans will say he would have had us winning the league by now, I think we'd have made the play-offs, which would have been a bang average return for the money he was given. We still might.

I don't think for one minute the football under SE was dull. It was much better than the previous two managers

Would SE have guided us to wins against the teams you mention. Of course he would . We would have been at least seven points better off. We had momentum, just like he said we would be better the second half of the season.

The one thing you are right about we would have made the playoffs at least. I think third spot was more likely. You say a play off place would have been bang average for this expensive squad. So what will you call them when we achieve eight spot or below.

I'm frustratingly disappointed at how things have gone. So far DF points hawl has been incredibly bad. I want him to succeed but if there is no upturn before the end of the season I think he has to go.

As for SE I feel totally let down by his decision to walk out, but I am glad he's gone. I rather us be in league two and be shot of him.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby daddycool » Tue Apr 10, 2018 5:04 am

Amber Andy wrote:
Rob wrote:
Terry Eccles Was God wrote:I don’t dislike him, but seven games in now and we still haven’t won seems a long time ago since we stuffed Newport 5-0 and beat Exeter away in Feb just before Evans shafted us. Of course, the players who were top four were really sub standard all along though, if you subscribe to the reinventing of history theory.


I subscribe to the see it with my own eyes theory, as we discussed many times, I was not impressed with our lack of style and whilst we were hard to beat, it was pretty dull to watch. We'll never know where we'd be now if Evans had stayed, but he left just before we played County, Luton, Accrington & Lincoln, based on what we saw against Cov I have no reason to think our results against those 4 would have been any better. FGR and Crewe have, it has to be said, been hugely disappointing, the much vaunted players have let their manager down. Was it Flitcrofts fault Diamond played like he'd never seen a football?

Clearly those who rate Evans will say he would have had us winning the league by now, I think we'd have made the play-offs, which would have been a bang average return for the money he was given. We still might.

I don't think for one minute the football under SE was dull. It was much better than the previous two managers

Would SE have guided us to wins against the teams you mention. Of course he would . We would have been at least seven points better off. We had momentum, just like he said we would be better the second half of the season.

The one thing you are right about we would have made the playoffs at least. I think third spot was more likely. You say a play off place would have been bang average for this expensive squad. So what will you call them when we achieve eight spot or below.

I'm frustratingly disappointed at how things have gone. So far DF points hawl has been incredibly bad. I want him to succeed but if there is no upturn before the end of the season I think he has to go.

As for SE I feel totally let down by his decision to walk out, but I am glad he's gone. I rather us be in league two and be shot of him.


Off course nobody knows if Evans would have done better ,you can only guess ,on the terms of probability .
Probably yes ,but not certainly.
You cannot alter what’s gone . But I would expect to quickly alter the future of tues goes wrong.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby abc » Tue Apr 10, 2018 5:58 am

Amber Andy wrote:
Rob wrote:
Terry Eccles Was God wrote:I don’t dislike him, but seven games in now and we still haven’t won seems a long time ago since we stuffed Newport 5-0 and beat Exeter away in Feb just before Evans shafted us. Of course, the players who were top four were really sub standard all along though, if you subscribe to the reinventing of history theory.


I subscribe to the see it with my own eyes theory, as we discussed many times, I was not impressed with our lack of style and whilst we were hard to beat, it was pretty dull to watch. We'll never know where we'd be now if Evans had stayed, but he left just before we played County, Luton, Accrington & Lincoln, based on what we saw against Cov I have no reason to think our results against those 4 would have been any better. FGR and Crewe have, it has to be said, been hugely disappointing, the much vaunted players have let their manager down. Was it Flitcrofts fault Diamond played like he'd never seen a football?

Clearly those who rate Evans will say he would have had us winning the league by now, I think we'd have made the play-offs, which would have been a bang average return for the money he was given. We still might.

I don't think for one minute the football under SE was dull. It was much better than the previous two managers

Would SE have guided us to wins against the teams you mention. Of course he would . We would have been at least seven points better off. We had momentum, just like he said we would be better the second half of the season.

The one thing you are right about we would have made the playoffs at least. I think third spot was more likely. You say a play off place would have been bang average for this expensive squad. So what will you call them when we achieve eight spot or below.

I'm frustratingly disappointed at how things have gone. So far DF points hawl has been incredibly bad. I want him to succeed but if there is no upturn before the end of the season I think he has to go.

As for SE I feel totally let down by his decision to walk out, but I am glad he's gone. I rather us be in league two and be shot of him.


Rather us be in league 2 than have Evans as manager ? Says it all really.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Amber Andy » Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:11 am

abc wrote:
Amber Andy wrote:
Rob wrote:
Terry Eccles Was God wrote:I don’t dislike him, but seven games in now and we still haven’t won seems a long time ago since we stuffed Newport 5-0 and beat Exeter away in Feb just before Evans shafted us. Of course, the players who were top four were really sub standard all along though, if you subscribe to the reinventing of history theory.


I subscribe to the see it with my own eyes theory, as we discussed many times, I was not impressed with our lack of style and whilst we were hard to beat, it was pretty dull to watch. We'll never know where we'd be now if Evans had stayed, but he left just before we played County, Luton, Accrington & Lincoln, based on what we saw against Cov I have no reason to think our results against those 4 would have been any better. FGR and Crewe have, it has to be said, been hugely disappointing, the much vaunted players have let their manager down. Was it Flitcrofts fault Diamond played like he'd never seen a football?

Clearly those who rate Evans will say he would have had us winning the league by now, I think we'd have made the play-offs, which would have been a bang average return for the money he was given. We still might.

I don't think for one minute the football under SE was dull. It was much better than the previous two managers

Would SE have guided us to wins against the teams you mention. Of course he would . We would have been at least seven points better off. We had momentum, just like he said we would be better the second half of the season.

The one thing you are right about we would have made the playoffs at least. I think third spot was more likely. You say a play off place would have been bang average for this expensive squad. So what will you call them when we achieve eight spot or below.

I'm frustratingly disappointed at how things have gone. So far DF points hawl has been incredibly bad. I want him to succeed but if there is no upturn before the end of the season I think he has to go.

As for SE I feel totally let down by his decision to walk out, but I am glad he's gone. I rather us be in league two and be shot of him.


Rather us be in league 2 than have Evans as manager ? Says it all really.
Peterborough fans have now got to live with the chance of him leaving whenever another job becomes available, especially if they don't get promoted this season. How long will he stay in his dream job. Will he complete the project. I think he must be a Clash fan and his favourite tune "Should I stay or should I go " is constantly playing in his mind.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby PRL13 » Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:54 am

I think fatty underachieved with what he blew all that money on! Flitcroft seems too comfortable with his position. He should look over his shoulder now. He needs a good run in, starting now! John can then decide on what happens in the closed season.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby tillydog123 » Tue Apr 10, 2018 9:55 am

I think with Evans there was always hope of promotion , always a combative nature to proceedings, banter and comments, antics, which some of us did not like but there was a spark about the place and anticipation of things going on backed with real intent by JR and CR.
In essence now, in my humble view, the management seem to me to be a little boring and pedestrian and little fire and desire which seems to have affected the players and whole dynamics of the club.
I am willing, like most reasonable supporters after watching and hoping for Stags meteoric rise in the football pyramid for so long since 1969 to give him his fair chance.

The real stigma for me will be yet another squad re build all over again with talk for about 10 games in and still not doing well of allowing players to gell.!!!
We cant seem to get into this long term plan but guess SE has done the dirty on it and for that I really feel for JR and CR and they must feel stabbed in the back many times over.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby geoffhill » Tue Apr 10, 2018 10:14 am

Flitcroft will be here next season I feel sure.Evans left us at a bad time for sure.He has gone now so get over it and support the manager.The form of some of the players since Evans left has been patchy Notably Macdonald Diamond has a really poor game which I do not understand from such an experienced player.If we are still in this league then it will be a disappointment but the club has to carry on.JR deserves something better and I think we will get promotion eventually.COYS.
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Re: Pro Flitcroft

Postby Conker » Tue Apr 10, 2018 10:16 am

Our record against the top lot was very good with Evans, let’s be honest nobody knows for certain but if he was still in charge we would be competing for the top three at least.
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